Workshop with Keith Lazelle

In article , Tudor Bosman
wrote:

I stated a fact. Logging is mostly done for construction, with firewood
a distant second. Paper manufacturing is out of the picture.

I guess all those wood chips I see going into the local paper mill came
from...uh...manna?

You care about trees? Put your money where your mouth is; go out there
and plant a few. On the other hand- do you know that there are about 3
times as many trees in the US now than in the 1920s (in part thanks to
the environmentalist movement, no doubt)? Perhaps it's time to focus on
other things.

I've planted trees. The timber companies are doing an excellent job of
replenishing the crop because it's in their best interests.

Worried about oil drilling in Alaska? Nuclear power IS safe[1], and we
have the technology to keep the waste in storage for some 10,000 years
or so. Get over your silly fears and maybe we won't need to drill there.

Odd, a liberal advocating nuclear power. I work on the grounds of two
uncompleted nuke plants. Back in the 80s the State of WA tried to
build 5 nuke plants and went broke. I work on the site of two that
were built together and neither ever generated bit of
electricity...because they were never completed and the system went
broke.

In article , Tudor Bosman
wrote:

I stated a fact. Logging is mostly done for construction, with firewood
a distant second. Paper manufacturing is out of the picture.

I guess all those wood chips I see going into the local paper mill came
from...uh...manna?

You care about trees? Put your money where your mouth is; go out there
and plant a few. On the other hand- do you know that there are about 3
times as many trees in the US now than in the 1920s (in part thanks to
the environmentalist movement, no doubt)? Perhaps it's time to focus on
other things.

I've planted trees. The timber companies are doing an excellent job of
replenishing the crop because it's in their best interests.

Worried about oil drilling in Alaska? Nuclear power IS safe[1], and we
have the technology to keep the waste in storage for some 10,000 years
or so. Get over your silly fears and maybe we won't need to drill there.

Odd, a liberal advocating nuclear power. I work on the grounds of two
uncompleted nuke plants. Back in the 80s the State of WA tried to
build 5 nuke plants and went broke. I work on the site of two that
were built together and neither ever generated bit of
electricity...because they were never completed and the system went
broke.

In article , Tudor Bosman
wrote:

I stated a fact. Logging is mostly done for construction, with firewood
a distant second. Paper manufacturing is out of the picture.

I guess all those wood chips I see going into the local paper mill came
from...uh...manna?

You care about trees? Put your money where your mouth is; go out there
and plant a few. On the other hand- do you know that there are about 3
times as many trees in the US now than in the 1920s (in part thanks to
the environmentalist movement, no doubt)? Perhaps it's time to focus on
other things.

I've planted trees. The timber companies are doing an excellent job of
replenishing the crop because it's in their best interests.

Worried about oil drilling in Alaska? Nuclear power IS safe[1], and we
have the technology to keep the waste in storage for some 10,000 years
or so. Get over your silly fears and maybe we won't need to drill there.

Odd, a liberal advocating nuclear power. I work on the grounds of two
uncompleted nuke plants. Back in the 80s the State of WA tried to
build 5 nuke plants and went broke. I work on the site of two that
were built together and neither ever generated bit of
electricity...because they were never completed and the system went
broke.

Michael Scarpitti wrote:
"John" wrote in message m...

May I ask a civil question (because I really don't understand)?:

Why would ANYONE be against preserving the environment?



BECAUSE IT COSTS MONEY AND JOBS, DICKHEAD!

Why do factory jobs keep going oversees, dumbass? Environmental
regulations and unions.


Factory jobs moved overseas because companies found out, that they could
pay a worker in India or China $25 a day, rather then $25 an hour plus
$20 an hour worth of benefits, essentially to do a job that a chimpanzee
could accomplish.


W

Tudor Bosman wrote:

I see no problem with a photographer leading people on a tour through a
natural preserve. I'm sure there are plenty of photo opportunities in
there, and if you think it's worth it to pay $50 to avoid dealing with
permits and government officials, then go ahead.

What I see a problem with is someone (photographer or not, of either
liberal or conservative persuasion) spewing lies and twisting the facts
about the environment under the pretext of a photographic workshop. But
this is nothing but a hypothetical scenario, of course, and I have no
reason to suspect Mr Lazelle of doing so.


Actually it's quite simple, lets hope that Mr. Lazelle tells his
tourists, the one simple rule of going into any wild area:

Leave it exactly as you found it.

That means:

If you have anything you no longer need, pack it out.
Don't step off the trails.
Don't remove anything, animal, vegetable or mineral.
If camping, use designated sites only.

The only evidence you have been their should be on film or memory cards.

W

Tudor Bosman wrote:

I see no problem with a photographer leading people on a tour through a
natural preserve. I'm sure there are plenty of photo opportunities in
there, and if you think it's worth it to pay $50 to avoid dealing with
permits and government officials, then go ahead.

What I see a problem with is someone (photographer or not, of either
liberal or conservative persuasion) spewing lies and twisting the facts
about the environment under the pretext of a photographic workshop. But
this is nothing but a hypothetical scenario, of course, and I have no
reason to suspect Mr Lazelle of doing so.


Actually it's quite simple, lets hope that Mr. Lazelle tells his
tourists, the one simple rule of going into any wild area:

Leave it exactly as you found it.

That means:

If you have anything you no longer need, pack it out.
Don't step off the trails.
Don't remove anything, animal, vegetable or mineral.
If camping, use designated sites only.

The only evidence you have been their should be on film or memory cards.

W

Thanks for your civil answer rolling eyes.

Why is it these discussions always turn into SHOUTING and insults? Can't we
have a civil discussion any more?

- John

PS - There are many things that COST MONEY that are nevertheless worthwhile.

"Michael Scarpitti" wrote in message
om...
"John" wrote in message
m...
May I ask a civil question (because I really don't understand)?:

Why would ANYONE be against preserving the environment?


BECAUSE IT COSTS MONEY AND JOBS, DICKHEAD!

Why do factory jobs keep going oversees, dumbass? Environmental
regulations and unions.



I'm really very curious - I've never met anyone personally who felt that
way
(particularly who was so virulent about it), so would like to understand.
I
would greatly appreciate it if you'd take the time to explain your
position,
seriously.

- John

"Randall Ainsworth" wrote in message
...
In article , Information
wrote:

There are no oil rigs in Yellowstone and nobody is proposing to put
them there.
No, you're not packs of goons...just a bunch of elitist liberals.

Thank you for your moderate response. I think many of us feel the same
way - it's just that the extremes at either end get so vehement (i.e., ALL
environmental regulations are bad, NO trees should ever be cut down, etc.)
that the level of discourse quickly becomes too hot to handle.

- John

"Tudor Bosman" wrote in message
...
Randall Ainsworth wrote:
And who is logging your precious old growth forests? Nobody in these
parts.

I stated a fact. Logging is mostly done for construction, with firewood a
distant second. Paper manufacturing is out of the picture.

I'm a liberal with the feet on the ground. I think science and technology
should liberate, and not burden us; I think we need to distance ourselves
from issues and look at them with a cool eye. I dislike both the
self-serving interests of the right, and the incessant nay saying of the
left. Environment is an important issue, but by far not the only one;
policy and decision-making are about striking a balance between the damage
that we inflict, and the benefits that we get in return.

You care about trees? Put your money where your mouth is; go out there
and plant a few. On the other hand- do you know that there are about 3
times as many trees in the US now than in the 1920s (in part thanks to the
environmentalist movement, no doubt)? Perhaps it's time to focus on other
things.

Worried about oil drilling in Alaska? Nuclear power IS safe[1], and we
have the technology to keep the waste in storage for some 10,000 years or
so. Get over your silly fears and maybe we won't need to drill there.

I see no problem with a photographer leading people on a tour through a
natural preserve. I'm sure there are plenty of photo opportunities in
there, and if you think it's worth it to pay $50 to avoid dealing with
permits and government officials, then go ahead.

What I see a problem with is someone (photographer or not, of either
liberal or conservative persuasion) spewing lies and twisting the facts
about the environment under the pretext of a photographic workshop. But
this is nothing but a hypothetical scenario, of course, and I have no
reason to suspect Mr Lazelle of doing so.

-Tudor.

[1] Before y'all start: yes, there have been accidents; yes, people have
died. This is true for pretty much any kind of technology, and nuclear
reactor technology has advanced significantly since Chernobyl and Long
Mile Island; Pebble bed reactors
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pebble_bed_reactor) can't melt down by
design.



--
To reply by email, remove two L's from "freLLlling"

Because Scarpetey is a clown virtually no one in any photo forum takes
him seriously, sad but true that some people act that way.



In article ,
"John" wrote:

Thanks for your civil answer rolling eyes.

Why is it these discussions always turn into SHOUTING and insults? Can't we
have a civil discussion any more?

- John

PS - There are many things that COST MONEY that are nevertheless worthwhile.

"Michael Scarpitti" wrote in message

Because Scarpetey is a clown virtually no one in any photo forum takes
him seriously, sad but true that some people act that way.



In article ,
"John" wrote:

Thanks for your civil answer rolling eyes.

Why is it these discussions always turn into SHOUTING and insults? Can't we
have a civil discussion any more?

- John

PS - There are many things that COST MONEY that are nevertheless worthwhile.

"Michael Scarpitti" wrote in message