How to determine if a digital photograph has been manipulated

On 2016-10-23 02:54:29 +0000, Bill W said:

On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 19:45:01 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:
On 2016-10-23 02:27:26 +0000, Bill W said:
On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 18:37:19 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:
On 2016-10-23 01:07:08 +0000, Bill W said:
On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 06:15:28 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

The next time you go out taking photos try wearing a clown outfit.

Hmmm. My understanding is that clown suits are temporarily
problematic.

;-)
...but just think of all the shots you can get of folks running from
you, and of cops running towards you.

What shutter speed will capture bullets mid-flight?

Here, I shrunk the people in your photo:
https://www.flickr.com/gp/48982192@N05/91481y

I wanted to see if I could do it. I used DXO Viewpoint first, but that
wasn't enough. I went to PS, then to Transform-Scale, and selected
and transformed each of the two r/s windows separately. It came out
okay, but I think someone who knows what he's doing could do a pretty
good job with this technique.

Yup! You compressed the sides a bit which did squeeze them down a tad,
but also did a number on the window.

Yeah, as I posted that, I looked across the room at the other display
with the photo, and saw what a mess the perspective had become. It
makes me a little dizzy to look at it.

That can happen. For my part, it was an exercise in seeing what I could
do to fix the unfixable.

Rather than work off my reworked
shot, here is the original RAW (as DNG) for you to play with.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/Demo/DNC_8018.dng

I'll have to give it a try. I haven't done anything with photography
lately. How can there be so many distractions when you're retired?

These days I have an open appointment book, so it is great to be able
to lose myself in seeing what can be done with my shots, including
revisions of shots I believed I was done with years ago.

I also have 3 or 4 other shots taken at the same time with less extreme
angles and slightly different action from the ladies. The guy remains
deadpan throughout his ordeal. I will post some of those later to show
some of the sequence.

Anyway, here are two other shots from the 2011 sequence at the "Frog &
Peach" with less radical perspective correction needed:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/Demo/DNC_8014.jpg
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/Demo/DNC_8016.jpg
--
Regards,

Savageduck

On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 19:45:01 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On 2016-10-23 02:27:26 +0000, Bill W said:

On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 18:37:19 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:
On 2016-10-23 01:07:08 +0000, Bill W said:
On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 06:15:28 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

The next time you go out taking photos try wearing a clown outfit.

Hmmm. My understanding is that clown suits are temporarily
problematic.

;-)
...but just think of all the shots you can get of folks running from
you, and of cops running towards you.

What shutter speed will capture bullets mid-flight?

Here, I shrunk the people in your photo:
https://www.flickr.com/gp/48982192@N05/91481y

I wanted to see if I could do it. I used DXO Viewpoint first, but that
wasn't enough. I went to PS, then to Transform-Scale, and selected
and transformed each of the two r/s windows separately. It came out
okay, but I think someone who knows what he's doing could do a pretty
good job with this technique.

Yup! You compressed the sides a bit which did squeeze them down a tad,
but also did a number on the window. Rather than work off my reworked
shot, here is the original RAW (as DNG) for you to play with.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/Demo/DNC_8018.dng

I also have 3 or 4 other shots taken at the same time with less extreme
angles and slightly different action from the ladies. The guy remains
deadpan throughout his ordeal. I will post some of those later to show
some of the sequence.

Okay, I tried for the first time working with perspective warp, but
also did a little in DXO Viewpoint and LR. I tried to change the
perspective to front and center of the 3 windows:
https://www.flickr.com/gp/48982192@N05/91481y

It's pretty interesting to see what can be done, but my results are
still off, and still make me a little dizzy...

On 2016-10-23 03:44:26 +0000, Bill W said:

On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 19:45:01 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On 2016-10-23 02:27:26 +0000, Bill W said:

On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 18:37:19 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:
On 2016-10-23 01:07:08 +0000, Bill W said:
On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 06:15:28 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

The next time you go out taking photos try wearing a clown outfit.

Hmmm. My understanding is that clown suits are temporarily
problematic.

;-)
...but just think of all the shots you can get of folks running from
you, and of cops running towards you.

What shutter speed will capture bullets mid-flight?

Here, I shrunk the people in your photo:
https://www.flickr.com/gp/48982192@N05/91481y

I wanted to see if I could do it. I used DXO Viewpoint first, but that
wasn't enough. I went to PS, then to Transform-Scale, and selected
and transformed each of the two r/s windows separately. It came out
okay, but I think someone who knows what he's doing could do a pretty
good job with this technique.

Yup! You compressed the sides a bit which did squeeze them down a tad,
but also did a number on the window. Rather than work off my reworked
shot, here is the original RAW (as DNG) for you to play with.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/Demo/DNC_8018.dng

I also have 3 or 4 other shots taken at the same time with less extreme
angles and slightly different action from the ladies. The guy remains
deadpan throughout his ordeal. I will post some of those later to show
some of the sequence.

Okay, I tried for the first time working with perspective warp, but
also did a little in DXO Viewpoint and LR. I tried to change the
perspective to front and center of the 3 windows:
https://www.flickr.com/gp/48982192@N05/91481y

It's pretty interesting to see what can be done, but my results are
still off, and still make me a little dizzy...

I guess that is the point, it is challenging and interesting to see
what can be done.

The tools we have today are so versatile and powerful, but they are
useless unless we exercise our brains and develop techniques for those
times we truly need those extra features to create a different, or
better image. I feel that as a hobbyist photographer I am constantly
climbing the post processing learning curve and there is never a dull
moment.
Of course, all of that post processing is quite seperate from what is
needed to capture the image in the first place. Recognising a subject
or scene for its potential, along with initial composition and
understanding of exposure criteria is essential, and is probably far
more important than choice of camera.

--
Regards,

Savageduck

In article 2016102219450166771-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom,
Savageduck wrote:

On 2016-10-23 02:27:26 +0000, Bill W said:

On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 18:37:19 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:
On 2016-10-23 01:07:08 +0000, Bill W said:
On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 06:15:28 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

The next time you go out taking photos try wearing a clown outfit.

Hmmm. My understanding is that clown suits are temporarily
problematic.

;-)
...but just think of all the shots you can get of folks running from
you, and of cops running towards you.

What shutter speed will capture bullets mid-flight?

Here, I shrunk the people in your photo:
https://www.flickr.com/gp/48982192@N05/91481y

I wanted to see if I could do it. I used DXO Viewpoint first, but that
wasn't enough. I went to PS, then to Transform-Scale, and selected
and transformed each of the two r/s windows separately. It came out
okay, but I think someone who knows what he's doing could do a pretty
good job with this technique.

Yup! You compressed the sides a bit which did squeeze them down a tad,
but also did a number on the window. Rather than work off my reworked
shot, here is the original RAW (as DNG) for you to play with.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/Demo/DNC_8018.dng

I'll bite. I did a quick and dirty raw2tiff in preview and some
adjustments in ViewPoint but no other adjustments:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/...18_DxOVP.jpg?d
l=0

I also have 3 or 4 other shots taken at the same time with less extreme
angles and slightly different action from the ladies. The guy remains
deadpan throughout his ordeal. I will post some of those later to show
some of the sequence.
--
teleportation kills

In article 2016102209564437304-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom,
Savageduck wrote:

On 2016-10-22 16:41:50 +0000, android said:

In article 2016102209384396576-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom,
Savageduck wrote:

On 2016-10-22 16:32:10 +0000, android said:

In article 2016102206152888260-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom,
Savageduck wrote:

Here is the side-by-side comparison, and that tells the manipulation
story.
Nothing was added or removed, there were some selective color, NR, &
exposure adjustments, and a crop to make stuff fit, all done in
Lightroom CC.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...enshot_285.jpg


And a keystone adjustment that makes the folks in the window look even
more overweight...

All done in fun.
...but not really a keystone adjustment, it was a horizontal
perspective adjustment, just to see what was possible.

That would be keystone sideways. Whatever...

;-)
Keystone usually implies a vertical perspective issue.

Well, I know that but that is what it's called by the DxO, and others i
think. You go to France and kill them... And it is the same thing,
really.
--
teleportation kills

In article 2016102219450166771-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom,
Savageduck wrote:

On 2016-10-23 02:27:26 +0000, Bill W said:

On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 18:37:19 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:
On 2016-10-23 01:07:08 +0000, Bill W said:
On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 06:15:28 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

The next time you go out taking photos try wearing a clown outfit.

Hmmm. My understanding is that clown suits are temporarily
problematic.

;-)
...but just think of all the shots you can get of folks running from
you, and of cops running towards you.

What shutter speed will capture bullets mid-flight?

Here, I shrunk the people in your photo:
https://www.flickr.com/gp/48982192@N05/91481y

I wanted to see if I could do it. I used DXO Viewpoint first, but that
wasn't enough. I went to PS, then to Transform-Scale, and selected
and transformed each of the two r/s windows separately. It came out
okay, but I think someone who knows what he's doing could do a pretty
good job with this technique.

Yup! You compressed the sides a bit which did squeeze them down a tad,
but also did a number on the window. Rather than work off my reworked
shot, here is the original RAW (as DNG) for you to play with.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/Demo/DNC_8018.dng

I'll bite. I did a quick and dirty raw2tiff in preview and some
adjustments in ViewPoint but no other adjustments:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/...18_DxOVP.jpg?d
l=0

Edit: Screenshot added:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/...18_DxOVPss.jpg
?dl=0

I also have 3 or 4 other shots taken at the same time with less extreme
angles and slightly different action from the ladies. The guy remains
deadpan throughout his ordeal. I will post some of those later to show
some of the sequence.
--
teleportation kills

On 2016-10-23 07:15:18 +0000, android said:

In article 2016102219450166771-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom,
Savageduck wrote:

On 2016-10-23 02:27:26 +0000, Bill W said:

On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 18:37:19 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:
On 2016-10-23 01:07:08 +0000, Bill W said:
On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 06:15:28 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

The next time you go out taking photos try wearing a clown outfit.

Hmmm. My understanding is that clown suits are temporarily
problematic.

;-)
...but just think of all the shots you can get of folks running from
you, and of cops running towards you.

What shutter speed will capture bullets mid-flight?

Here, I shrunk the people in your photo:
https://www.flickr.com/gp/48982192@N05/91481y

I wanted to see if I could do it. I used DXO Viewpoint first, but that
wasn't enough. I went to PS, then to Transform-Scale, and selected
and transformed each of the two r/s windows separately. It came out
okay, but I think someone who knows what he's doing could do a pretty
good job with this technique.

Yup! You compressed the sides a bit which did squeeze them down a tad,
but also did a number on the window. Rather than work off my reworked
shot, here is the original RAW (as DNG) for you to play with.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1295663/Demo/DNC_8018.dng

I'll bite. I did a quick and dirty raw2tiff in preview and some
adjustments in ViewPoint but no other adjustments:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/mt5dsf0o8rfwmgp/DNC_8018_DxOVP.jpg?dl=0

Edit: Screenshot added:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/die5l8mcdvxcqjj/DNC_8018_DxOVPss.jpg?dl=0

I also have 3 or 4 other shots taken at the same time with less extreme
angles and slightly different action from the ladies. The guy remains
deadpan throughout his ordeal. I will post some of those later to show
some of the sequence.

You got practically the same result as Bill with the compression to the
windows. Both of you were using DxO ViewPoint, so that was to be
expected. The big difference was including the bulletin board on the
left. Ultimately, the challenge of working with a shot like that, is
exercising the limits of various perspective correction software.
....and it is fun.


--
Regards,

Savageduck

On 2016-10-23 06:36:00 +0000, android said:

In article 2016102209564437304-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom,
Savageduck wrote:
On 2016-10-22 16:41:50 +0000, android said:
In article 2016102209384396576-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom,
Savageduck wrote:
On 2016-10-22 16:32:10 +0000, android said:
In article 2016102206152888260-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom,
Savageduck wrote:

Here is the side-by-side comparison, and that tells the manipulation
story.
Nothing was added or removed, there were some selective color, NR, &
exposure adjustments, and a crop to make stuff fit, all done in
Lightroom CC.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...enshot_285.jpg


And a keystone adjustment that makes the folks in the window look even
more overweight...

All done in fun.
...but not really a keystone adjustment, it was a horizontal
perspective adjustment, just to see what was possible.

That would be keystone sideways. Whatever...

;-)
Keystone usually implies a vertical perspective issue.

Well, I know that but that is what it's called by the DxO, and others i
think. You go to France and kill them... And it is the same thing,
really.

Aah! That's it, I don't speak French.

--
Regards,

Savageduck

In article ,
Bill W wrote:

On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 18:37:19 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On 2016-10-23 01:07:08 +0000, Bill W said:

On Sat, 22 Oct 2016 06:15:28 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

The next time you go out taking photos try wearing a clown outfit.

Hmmm. My understanding is that clown suits are temporarily
problematic.

;-)
...but just think of all the shots you can get of folks running from
you, and of cops running towards you.

What shutter speed will capture bullets mid-flight?

Here, I shrunk the people in your photo:
https://www.flickr.com/gp/48982192@N05/91481y

I wanted to see if I could do it. I used DXO Viewpoint first, but that
wasn't enough. I went to PS, then to Transform-Scale, and selected
and transformed each of the two r/s windows separately. It came out
okay, but I think someone who knows what he's doing could do a pretty
good job with this technique.

Yes...
--
teleportation kills