Questions about olde tyme lens

My latest find from *Bay just arrived: an old brass-n-chrome Bausch & Lomb
lens in shutter. Actually, I'm not sure just what to call it. There are three
names on it: "Victor" at the bottom on the aperture scale, Bausch & Lomb Opt.
Co. around the bottom of the lens, and R.O. & C. Co. on the shutter speed
dial. So is it a Victor, a B&L, a Rochester Optical, or what? (The B&L patent
date is '91.)

Anyhoo, I got it for my Rochester 5x7 field camera, and it looks to be just
the ticket. The only markings on the lens barrel, "SYMMETRICAL" and "5x7"
suggest it to be the right lens for this size camera.

The shutter is simple, one might even say primitive--pneumatic, with the two
characteristic cylinders on the front--but elegant. Nice range of speeds:
1-2-5-25-100. Works, not accurately, and the blades (all both of them) don't
close completely at all speeds, but I'm confident I can easily put it back in
working order. (The diaphragm may actually be more work than the shutter, as
it forms a quite ugly pointy shape at small apertures (goes down to f/64).
Hopefully this is fixable.)

My questions are these:

1. What kind of lens is this? what focal length? (I'm guessing "normal" for
5x7, around 210mm or so.) The glass is very clean, with only the smallest
apparent separation right around the edge of the front cell.

2. I need a retaining ring. The threads seem to be about 33mm. Where would I
find one?

3. The lefthand cylinder seems to have a socket for a cable release, maybe,
but a standard modern release won't fit in the hole in the bottom. Is this why
there's a hole at the bottom? Without this, it'll be hard to use this shutter
without jarring the camera, as it takes a bit of force to trip the shutter
release.

Any other comments on the history and construction of this old lens & shutter
would be appreciated.


--
Everybody's worried about stopping terrorism. Well, there's a
really easy way: stop participating in it.

- Noam Chomsky

"David Nebenzahl" wrote in message
...
My latest find from *Bay just arrived: an old
brass-n-chrome Bausch & Lomb
lens in shutter. Actually, I'm not sure just what to call
it. There are three
names on it: "Victor" at the bottom on the aperture scale,
Bausch & Lomb Opt.
Co. around the bottom of the lens, and R.O. & C. Co. on
the shutter speed
dial. So is it a Victor, a B&L, a Rochester Optical, or
what? (The B&L patent
date is '91.)

Anyhoo, I got it for my Rochester 5x7 field camera, and it
looks to be just
the ticket. The only markings on the lens barrel,
"SYMMETRICAL" and "5x7"
suggest it to be the right lens for this size camera.

The shutter is simple, one might even say
primitive--pneumatic, with the two
characteristic cylinders on the front--but elegant. Nice
range of speeds:
1-2-5-25-100. Works, not accurately, and the blades (all
both of them) don't
close completely at all speeds, but I'm confident I can
easily put it back in
working order. (The diaphragm may actually be more work
than the shutter, as
it forms a quite ugly pointy shape at small apertures
(goes down to f/64).
Hopefully this is fixable.)

My questions are these:

1. What kind of lens is this? what focal length? (I'm
guessing "normal" for
5x7, around 210mm or so.) The glass is very clean, with
only the smallest
apparent separation right around the edge of the front
cell.

2. I need a retaining ring. The threads seem to be about
33mm. Where would I
find one?

3. The lefthand cylinder seems to have a socket for a
cable release, maybe,
but a standard modern release won't fit in the hole in the
bottom. Is this why
there's a hole at the bottom? Without this, it'll be hard
to use this shutter
without jarring the camera, as it takes a bit of force to
trip the shutter
release.

Any other comments on the history and construction of this
old lens & shutter
would be appreciated.


--
Everybody's worried about stopping terrorism. Well,
there's a
really easy way: stop participating in it.

- Noam Chomsky

I can't be absolutely sure without a book which is eluding
me at the moment but think the lens is an ROC lens and the
shutter Bausch & Lomb. The Rochester Optical and Camera
Company was formed by a merger of about nine companies in
1899. It was aquired by the Eastman Kodak Co. in 1903. From
the time of the purchase by Kodak the company was called the
Rochester Optical Co., in 1907 to Rochester Optical
Division, and in 1918 to Rochester Optical Department, of
Eastman Kodak. So, the R.O.& C suggests the shutter and lens
was made between 1899 and 1903. I suspect the lens is some
version of a Rapid-Rectilinear. Counting the reflections
will help, a R-R should have two bright and one dim
reflection for each cell. Somewhere I have more info on the
Victor shutter and remember seeing the "Symmetrical" lens in
a catalogue list. FWIW, B&L called their Rapid-Rectilinear
bu that name. I will look more tomorrow and post again if I
find more.
B&L and some other companies listed lenses by format
size. "Normal" for 5x7 is around 8 inches.
I suspect the shutter would respond to cleaning but
beware that the shutter and diaphragm blades may be made of
hard rubber or hard fiber. The first are heat sensitve,
latter won't stand getting wet.


--
---
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA

On 7/3/2004 4:07 AM Richard Knoppow spake thus:

"David Nebenzahl" wrote in message
...

My latest find from *Bay just arrived: an old brass-n-chrome Bausch &
Lomb lens in shutter. Actually, I'm not sure just what to call it. There
are three names on it: "Victor" at the bottom on the aperture scale,
Bausch & Lomb Opt. Co. around the bottom of the lens, and R.O. & C. Co.
on the shutter speed dial. So is it a Victor, a B&L, a Rochester Optical,
or what? (The B&L patent date is '91.)

Anyhoo, I got it for my Rochester 5x7 field camera, and it looks to be
just the ticket. The only markings on the lens barrel, "SYMMETRICAL" and
"5x7" suggest it to be the right lens for this size camera.

The shutter is simple, one might even say primitive--pneumatic, with the
two characteristic cylinders on the front--but elegant. Nice range of
speeds: 1-2-5-25-100. Works, not accurately, and the blades (all both of
them) don't close completely at all speeds, but I'm confident I can
easily put it back in working order. (The diaphragm may actually be more
work than the shutter, as it forms a quite ugly pointy shape at small
apertures (goes down to f/64). Hopefully this is fixable.)

My questions are these:

1. What kind of lens is this? what focal length? (I'm guessing "normal"
for 5x7, around 210mm or so.) The glass is very clean, with only the
smallest apparent separation right around the edge of the front cell.

2. I need a retaining ring. The threads seem to be about 33mm. Where
would I find one?

3. The lefthand cylinder seems to have a socket for a cable release,
maybe, but a standard modern release won't fit in the hole in the bottom.
Is this why there's a hole at the bottom? Without this, it'll be hard to
use this shutter without jarring the camera, as it takes a bit of force
to trip the shutter release.

Any other comments on the history and construction of this old lens &
shutter would be appreciated.

I can't be absolutely sure without a book which is eluding me at the moment
but think the lens is an ROC lens and the shutter Bausch & Lomb. The
Rochester Optical and Camera Company was formed by a merger of about nine
companies in 1899. It was aquired by the Eastman Kodak Co. in 1903. From
the time of the purchase by Kodak the company was called the Rochester
Optical Co., in 1907 to Rochester Optical Division, and in 1918 to
Rochester Optical Department, of Eastman Kodak. So, the R.O.& C suggests
the shutter and lens was made between 1899 and 1903. I suspect the lens is
some version of a Rapid-Rectilinear. Counting the reflections will help, a
R-R should have two bright and one dim reflection for each cell.

Yep, that's what I see both front & back.

Somewhere I have more info on the Victor shutter and remember seeing the
"Symmetrical" lens in a catalogue list. FWIW, B&L called their
Rapid-Rectilinear bu that name. I will look more tomorrow and post again
if I find more. B&L and some other companies listed lenses by format size.
"Normal" for 5x7 is around 8 inches. I suspect the shutter would respond to
cleaning but beware that the shutter and diaphragm blades may be made of
hard rubber or hard fiber. The first are heat sensitve, latter won't stand
getting wet.

Thanks again for, as usual, much useful and interesting information.

Two questions remain unanswered: the retaining ring, and cable release
problem. Do you know if these shutters were equipped to be used with some sort
of cable release?


--
Everybody's worried about stopping terrorism. Well, there's a
really easy way: stop participating in it.

- Noam Chomsky

"David Nebenzahl" wrote in message
...
On 7/3/2004 4:07 AM Richard Knoppow spake thus:

"David Nebenzahl" wrote in
message
...

Long post snipped...

Thanks again for, as usual, much useful and interesting
information.

Two questions remain unanswered: the retaining ring, and
cable release
problem. Do you know if these shutters were equipped to be
used with some sort
of cable release?


Early shutters were more likely to have an air release
than a cable release. If the shutter has two cylenders on it
one is probably an air release. It should have a nipple for
a hose on it. If so you need some hose (Pep Boys or other
automotive parts dealer) and a bulb. Bulbs are hard to find
other than buying them from Packard shutters
http://www.hubphoto.com but you may be able to find a
replacement one for a blook pressure guage or similar.
I don't remember what the problem was with the retaining
ring. Old shutters usually had mounting flanges. A good
machinist can make one for you if you show him another
similar one. Steve Grimes shop will make one but you may be
able to get it done locally for less. A machinist can
measure the threads on the shutter.


--
---
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA

"David Nebenzahl" wrote in message
...
On 7/3/2004 4:07 AM Richard Knoppow spake thus:

"David Nebenzahl" wrote in
message
...

Long post snipped...

Thanks again for, as usual, much useful and interesting
information.

Two questions remain unanswered: the retaining ring, and
cable release
problem. Do you know if these shutters were equipped to be
used with some sort
of cable release?


Early shutters were more likely to have an air release
than a cable release. If the shutter has two cylenders on it
one is probably an air release. It should have a nipple for
a hose on it. If so you need some hose (Pep Boys or other
automotive parts dealer) and a bulb. Bulbs are hard to find
other than buying them from Packard shutters
http://www.hubphoto.com but you may be able to find a
replacement one for a blook pressure guage or similar.
I don't remember what the problem was with the retaining
ring. Old shutters usually had mounting flanges. A good
machinist can make one for you if you show him another
similar one. Steve Grimes shop will make one but you may be
able to get it done locally for less. A machinist can
measure the threads on the shutter.


--
---
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA