6mb=12mb digital, advantages?

I currently use a Canon 10D SLR digital, but at some point in the next
couple of years I see myself being sure I have a really professional
camera. What advantages are there, other than cropping abilities, to
moving up to a really high end high megapixel camera (from my current
6.2mp) like 12 or 17 megapixel Canon camera? My main subject for
photography is the human figure (fashion, female nudes, portrait).

(typos on my original post-- I mean megapixels, not megabytes-- been a
long day, heading for some sleep now!)

If we
assume you are talking about a full frame sensor (e.g. 5D or 1Ds MkII),
the advantages a

- Not having a cropping factor killing your wide angle lenses(albeit a
cropping factor can be an advantage at the telephoto end)
- Higher resolution from just plain having more pixels
- Having relatively large pixels on these sensors also allow you
an additional resolution kick of sorts. For example, the larger
pixels
of a 5D vs. a 20D put less of a demand on the lens.

The logic is as follows:
Think of a lens producing an image of a subject containing an extremely
well defined point or edge. Any given lens has a limit (due to
diffraction even for an ideal lens) on how small the image of that
point or edge can be 'reproduced' at the image plane. As it turns out,
the pixel size of let's say a 20D and probably 10D are smaller than
that reproduced point(i.e. the lens has 'smeared' the image of that
point over a few pixels), so to some degree the sensor resolution is
'wasted'. With larger sensor pixels, this is less likely the case. I
don't know all the specifics here, but my understanding is that in the
real world the size of the sensor elements or pixels on the 5D or 1Ds
MkII fall into the range you want to be in to get the most out of real
world lenses.

- Lower noise (also due to larger pixels)
- Somewhat higher dynamic range (also due to larger pixels)

Proteus wrote:
I currently use a Canon 10D SLR digital, but at some point in the next
couple of years I see myself being sure I have a really professional
camera. What advantages are there, other than cropping abilities, to
moving up to a really high end high megapixel camera (from my current
6.2mp) like 12 or 17 megapixel Canon camera? My main subject for
photography is the human figure (fashion, female nudes, portrait).

"Proteus" wrote in message
news
I currently use a Canon 10D SLR digital, but at some point in the next
couple of years I see myself being sure I have a really professional
camera. What advantages are there, other than cropping abilities, to
moving up to a really high end high megapixel camera (from my current
6.2mp) like 12 or 17 megapixel Canon camera? My main subject for
photography is the human figure (fashion, female nudes, portrait).

12 mp will alow you to make larger prints without needing to interpolate.
Jim

"Jim" wrote in message
m...

"Proteus" wrote in message
news
I currently use a Canon 10D SLR digital, but at some point in the next
couple of years I see myself being sure I have a really professional
camera. What advantages are there, other than cropping abilities, to
moving up to a really high end high megapixel camera (from my current
6.2mp) like 12 or 17 megapixel Canon camera? My main subject for
photography is the human figure (fashion, female nudes, portrait).

12 mp will alow you to make larger prints without needing to interpolate.
Jim
Correct, everything else being equal, let me repeat everything else being
equal (which means ignore extaneous fluff of previous posts ), you will be
able to enlarge the image by a factor of 1.4142 each time you double the mp
count. Alternatively, you can crop one of the edges by same factor, enlarge
to previous and maintain same quality.
Dave Cohen

" writes:

If we
assume you are talking about a full frame sensor (e.g. 5D or 1Ds MkII),
the advantages a

- Not having a cropping factor killing your wide angle lenses(albeit a
cropping factor can be an advantage at the telephoto end)

The cropping factor is never an advantage. You can always crop the
image from an FF camera in software.

--
Måns Rullgård

"Måns Rullgård" wrote in message
...
" writes:

If we
assume you are talking about a full frame sensor (e.g. 5D or 1Ds MkII),
the advantages a

- Not having a cropping factor killing your wide angle lenses(albeit a
cropping factor can be an advantage at the telephoto end)

The cropping factor is never an advantage. You can always crop the
image from an FF camera in software.

--
Måns Rullgård



Didn't someone already show that an 5d image cropped to the same FOV as a
20d will have less pixels? Not to mention the wasted time in photoshop...I
think a lot of pros will still use their 20ds along with 5ds.

Today Jim spoke these views with conviction for everyone's
edification:

"Proteus" wrote in message
news
I currently use a Canon 10D SLR digital, but at some point
in the next
couple of years I see myself being sure I have a really
professional camera. What advantages are there, other than
cropping abilities, to moving up to a really high end high
megapixel camera (from my current 6.2mp) like 12 or 17
megapixel Canon camera? My main subject for photography
is the human figure (fashion, female nudes, portrait).

12 mp will alow you to make larger prints without needing
to interpolate. Jim

Obviously correct, Jim, but I might observe that fashion
photography or studio portraits often are actually softened to
be more flattering, particularly for women. So, I wonder how
much PPI is needed to do even a 11 x 14 portraits?

I don't know, I'm just making an observation noting that there's
typically no fine detail that gets wrecked when printing too
big.

But, if I use the usual bogey of 200 PPI minimum, that 11 x 14
would require a 2200 x 2800 image which is only 5.9 mega pixels
which the OP says he already owns.

If I were in the market for an expensive pro DSLR, I'd be more
interested in features, better color fideltity, lower noise,
RAW, what have you, and much less interested in 16 MP.

--
ATM, aka Jerry

Today Dave Cohen spoke these views with conviction for
everyone's edification:

Correct, everything else being equal, let me repeat
everything else being equal (which means ignore extaneous
fluff of previous posts ), you will be able to enlarge the
image by a factor of 1.4142 each time you double the mp
count. Alternatively, you can crop one of the edges by same
factor, enlarge to previous and maintain same quality.

I agree here, also, Dave. It wasn't all that long ago that I
"discovered" that I could do "digital zooms" by shooting at more
mega pixels than I thought I needed, and then cropped for best
composition without dropping below my pixel resolution target.

My primary subject is cars, but the principles are the same, I
think. I /always/ shoot at least 20% more of the background than
I think I need (if I can), preferring to do only the initial
best composure at shoot time, then cropping later to improve the
composure in PSP 9.

But, back to pictures of people, there's a big difference
between what one does when shooting candids vs. when the camera
is on a tripod with multiple lights in a portrait studio.

--
ATM, aka Jerry

"Dirty Harry" writes:

"Måns Rullgård" wrote in message
...
" writes:

If we
assume you are talking about a full frame sensor (e.g. 5D or 1Ds MkII),
the advantages a

- Not having a cropping factor killing your wide angle lenses(albeit a
cropping factor can be an advantage at the telephoto end)

The cropping factor is never an advantage. You can always crop the
image from an FF camera in software.

Didn't someone already show that an 5d image cropped to the same FOV as a
20d will have less pixels? Not to mention the wasted time in photoshop...I
think a lot of pros will still use their 20ds along with 5ds.

Then the advantage is not the cropping factor itself, but the higher
pixel density. Now high pixel density was mentioned as a disadvantage
by someone else. I'm not sure what to make of it.

--
Måns Rullgård