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Kodak to stop making digital cameras
On 16/02/2012 15:25, David Dyer-Bennet wrote:
John writes: On 2012-02-14 11:24:40 -0800, David said: writes: In Apple's case advertising is only part of the story. The level of customer satisfaction and word of mouth evangelizing has led to repeat sales and some switchers. Then came the iPod and advertising aimed at frustrated average PC users, not PC power users or IT specialists. That laid the groundwork for the iPhone, which the Apple community had been demanding from the release of the iPod. The iPod& iPhone led many PC users to Macs, both desktops and laptops. Now there are the MacBook Air and the iPad which have developed their own particular niche. By sticking to their particular design philosophy and product mystique the team at Cupertino has achieved its current success. That one I find fascinating. My Apple-using friends seem to have *endless* trouble with their computers, far more than my other friends. I have no idea where this reputation for "quality" comes from! Heh. Apple haters will always find anecdotes to support their pet theories. David- The quality is there, has almost always been there. So you claim. But my friends still make multiple trips a year to have things fixed. Are they particularly accident prone or do you sabotage their kit? Have you ever used a Macintosh for more than a couple of days? I tried to use one onec, back when I needed to make some graphic slides (overhead projector slides) for a presentation back when it was very new (1984 or 1985). I found it so hard to use (and so lacking in documentation) that it was much easier to use a command-line graphics tool (that I'd also never used before) to get the images I wanted, and have never by choice used one again. Seems you have rather strange selective memories of those times. A Macintosh could run rings around the IBM PC for graphics and artwork design back in those days unless you had an incredibly expensive NEC7220 dedicated graphics card fitted like the Sigma Dazzler with a correspondingly expensive monitor and editing software to go with it. VGA graphics didn't appear until 1987 though you could get hercules monochrome graphics cards in around '84 for the PC. -- Regards, Martin Brown |
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Kodak to stop making digital cameras
rOn Thu, 16 Feb 2012 20:11:55 +0000, Martin Brown
wrote: On 16/02/2012 15:25, David Dyer-Bennet wrote: John writes: On 2012-02-14 11:24:40 -0800, David said: writes: In Apple's case advertising is only part of the story. The level of customer satisfaction and word of mouth evangelizing has led to repeat sales and some switchers. Then came the iPod and advertising aimed at frustrated average PC users, not PC power users or IT specialists. That laid the groundwork for the iPhone, which the Apple community had been demanding from the release of the iPod. The iPod& iPhone led many PC users to Macs, both desktops and laptops. Now there are the MacBook Air and the iPad which have developed their own particular niche. By sticking to their particular design philosophy and product mystique the team at Cupertino has achieved its current success. That one I find fascinating. My Apple-using friends seem to have *endless* trouble with their computers, far more than my other friends. I have no idea where this reputation for "quality" comes from! Heh. Apple haters will always find anecdotes to support their pet theories. David- The quality is there, has almost always been there. So you claim. But my friends still make multiple trips a year to have things fixed. Are they particularly accident prone or do you sabotage their kit? Have you ever used a Macintosh for more than a couple of days? I tried to use one onec, back when I needed to make some graphic slides (overhead projector slides) for a presentation back when it was very new (1984 or 1985). I found it so hard to use (and so lacking in documentation) that it was much easier to use a command-line graphics tool (that I'd also never used before) to get the images I wanted, and have never by choice used one again. Seems you have rather strange selective memories of those times. A Macintosh could run rings around the IBM PC for graphics and artwork design back in those days unless you had an incredibly expensive NEC7220 dedicated graphics card fitted like the Sigma Dazzler with a correspondingly expensive monitor and editing software to go with it. VGA graphics didn't appear until 1987 though you could get hercules monochrome graphics cards in around '84 for the PC. Some 10 years before that you could the Cromemco 'Dazzler' cards (plural) for the S100 bus and CP/M Regards, Eric Stevens |
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Kodak to stop making digital cameras
Martin Brown writes:
On 16/02/2012 15:25, David Dyer-Bennet wrote: John writes: On 2012-02-14 11:24:40 -0800, David said: writes: In Apple's case advertising is only part of the story. The level of customer satisfaction and word of mouth evangelizing has led to repeat sales and some switchers. Then came the iPod and advertising aimed at frustrated average PC users, not PC power users or IT specialists. That laid the groundwork for the iPhone, which the Apple community had been demanding from the release of the iPod. The iPod& iPhone led many PC users to Macs, both desktops and laptops. Now there are the MacBook Air and the iPad which have developed their own particular niche. By sticking to their particular design philosophy and product mystique the team at Cupertino has achieved its current success. That one I find fascinating. My Apple-using friends seem to have *endless* trouble with their computers, far more than my other friends. I have no idea where this reputation for "quality" comes from! Heh. Apple haters will always find anecdotes to support their pet theories. David- The quality is there, has almost always been there. So you claim. But my friends still make multiple trips a year to have things fixed. Are they particularly accident prone or do you sabotage their kit? Possiblyh accident-prone. Mostly I've never touched any computer they own or on their network, so I'm reasonably sure I'm not doing it. Have you ever used a Macintosh for more than a couple of days? I tried to use one onec, back when I needed to make some graphic slides (overhead projector slides) for a presentation back when it was very new (1984 or 1985). I found it so hard to use (and so lacking in documentation) that it was much easier to use a command-line graphics tool (that I'd also never used before) to get the images I wanted, and have never by choice used one again. Seems you have rather strange selective memories of those times. A Macintosh could run rings around the IBM PC for graphics and artwork design back in those days unless you had an incredibly expensive NEC7220 dedicated graphics card fitted like the Sigma Dazzler with a correspondingly expensive monitor and editing software to go with it. VGA graphics didn't appear until 1987 though you could get hercules monochrome graphics cards in around '84 for the PC. Why are you inserting an IBM PC into the story? I didn't touch a PC for at least a year after that, and that was in a different state; has nothing to do with the story. -- David Dyer-Bennet, ; http://dd-b.net/ Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/ Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/ Dragaera: http://dragaera.info |
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Kodak to stop making digital cameras
On 16/02/2012 22:23, David Dyer-Bennet wrote:
Martin writes: On 16/02/2012 15:25, David Dyer-Bennet wrote: John writes: On 2012-02-14 11:24:40 -0800, David said: writes: Have you ever used a Macintosh for more than a couple of days? I tried to use one onec, back when I needed to make some graphic slides (overhead projector slides) for a presentation back when it was very new (1984 or 1985). I found it so hard to use (and so lacking in documentation) that it was much easier to use a command-line graphics tool (that I'd also never used before) to get the images I wanted, and have never by choice used one again. Seems you have rather strange selective memories of those times. A Macintosh could run rings around the IBM PC for graphics and artwork design back in those days unless you had an incredibly expensive NEC7220 dedicated graphics card fitted like the Sigma Dazzler with a correspondingly expensive monitor and editing software to go with it. VGA graphics didn't appear until 1987 though you could get hercules monochrome graphics cards in around '84 for the PC. Why are you inserting an IBM PC into the story? I didn't touch a PC for at least a year after that, and that was in a different state; has nothing to do with the story. So what kit and software were you comparing the Macintosh against then? Around that time (about 5 years earlier) we had tracker ball operated ARGS raster graphics 512x512 with a whopping 256 colour LUT available on the VAX 11/780's and monochrome 1024x1024 256 greyscale on a ND500. I can't off hand think of any command line graphics tool that could make OHP slides in that era. HP7475 would plot them if you had the software, but most big plotters were not flatbeds and used roll paper. Back then you pretty much had to make the orginals as oversize line artwork and then take them to a bench sized camera to make either an OHP slide, display quality print or an offset litho printing plate. -- Regards, Martin Brown |
#5
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Kodak to stop making digital cameras
Martin Brown writes:
On 16/02/2012 22:23, David Dyer-Bennet wrote: Martin writes: On 16/02/2012 15:25, David Dyer-Bennet wrote: John writes: On 2012-02-14 11:24:40 -0800, David said: writes: Have you ever used a Macintosh for more than a couple of days? I tried to use one onec, back when I needed to make some graphic slides (overhead projector slides) for a presentation back when it was very new (1984 or 1985). I found it so hard to use (and so lacking in documentation) that it was much easier to use a command-line graphics tool (that I'd also never used before) to get the images I wanted, and have never by choice used one again. Seems you have rather strange selective memories of those times. A Macintosh could run rings around the IBM PC for graphics and artwork design back in those days unless you had an incredibly expensive NEC7220 dedicated graphics card fitted like the Sigma Dazzler with a correspondingly expensive monitor and editing software to go with it. VGA graphics didn't appear until 1987 though you could get hercules monochrome graphics cards in around '84 for the PC. Why are you inserting an IBM PC into the story? I didn't touch a PC for at least a year after that, and that was in a different state; has nothing to do with the story. So what kit and software were you comparing the Macintosh against then? DECSYSTEM-20 mainframe with a GIGI graphics terminal. I don't remember the name of the software package I used; that was the first and last time I used the software. (I photographed the images off the GIGI screen with Polachrome film, just to insert a near-on-topic reference.) (And then learned one of the great lessons of presentations the hard way. I had previewed my slides at home and found them good, but when I did the actual presentation, the Polachrome slides were nearly invisible. Turns out they were a lot denser than the regular slides, which I hadn't noticed in the well-darkened room I previewed in, but which was totally obvious in the half-lit presentation room.) Around that time (about 5 years earlier) we had tracker ball operated ARGS raster graphics 512x512 with a whopping 256 colour LUT available on the VAX 11/780's and monochrome 1024x1024 256 greyscale on a ND500. I used monochrome storage-tube vector graphics earlier just a little bit, around 1972, but nothing with color. I can't off hand think of any command line graphics tool that could make OHP slides in that era. HP7475 would plot them if you had the software, but most big plotters were not flatbeds and used roll paper. Yes, I switched from an initial plan of OHP to 35mm slides at that point. Back then you pretty much had to make the orginals as oversize line artwork and then take them to a bench sized camera to make either an OHP slide, display quality print or an offset litho printing plate. Yep. -- David Dyer-Bennet, ; http://dd-b.net/ Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/ Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/ Dragaera: http://dragaera.info |
#6
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Kodak to stop making digital cameras
In article , David Dyer-Bennet
wrote: Why are you inserting an IBM PC into the story? I didn't touch a PC for at least a year after that, and that was in a different state; has nothing to do with the story. So what kit and software were you comparing the Macintosh against then? DECSYSTEM-20 mainframe with a GIGI graphics terminal. I don't remember the name of the software package I used; that was the first and last time I used the software. what a ludicrous comparison. |
#7
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Kodak to stop making digital cameras
On 2012-02-17 14:38 , nospam wrote:
In , David Dyer-Bennet wrote: Why are you inserting an IBM PC into the story? I didn't touch a PC for at least a year after that, and that was in a different state; has nothing to do with the story. So what kit and software were you comparing the Macintosh against then? DECSYSTEM-20 mainframe with a GIGI graphics terminal. I don't remember the name of the software package I used; that was the first and last time I used the software. what a ludicrous comparison. That's an insult to ludicrous comparisons. -- "We demand rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty." Douglas Adams - (Could have been a GPS engineer). |
#8
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Kodak to stop making digital cameras
nospam writes:
In article , David Dyer-Bennet wrote: Why are you inserting an IBM PC into the story? I didn't touch a PC for at least a year after that, and that was in a different state; has nothing to do with the story. So what kit and software were you comparing the Macintosh against then? DECSYSTEM-20 mainframe with a GIGI graphics terminal. I don't remember the name of the software package I used; that was the first and last time I used the software. what a ludicrous comparison. Yes, isn't it? And yet I found it much easier to produce the images I needed that way. -- David Dyer-Bennet, ; http://dd-b.net/ Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/ Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/ Dragaera: http://dragaera.info |
#9
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Kodak to stop making digital cameras
In article , David Dyer-Bennet
wrote: Why are you inserting an IBM PC into the story? I didn't touch a PC for at least a year after that, and that was in a different state; has nothing to do with the story. So what kit and software were you comparing the Macintosh against then? DECSYSTEM-20 mainframe with a GIGI graphics terminal. I don't remember the name of the software package I used; that was the first and last time I used the software. what a ludicrous comparison. Yes, isn't it? And yet I found it much easier to produce the images I needed that way. only because you couldn't be bothered to take a couple of minutes to learn a much easier way. |
#10
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Kodak to stop making digital cameras
nospam writes:
In article , David Dyer-Bennet wrote: Why are you inserting an IBM PC into the story? I didn't touch a PC for at least a year after that, and that was in a different state; has nothing to do with the story. So what kit and software were you comparing the Macintosh against then? DECSYSTEM-20 mainframe with a GIGI graphics terminal. I don't remember the name of the software package I used; that was the first and last time I used the software. what a ludicrous comparison. Yes, isn't it? And yet I found it much easier to produce the images I needed that way. only because you couldn't be bothered to take a couple of minutes to learn a much easier way. I wasted more time failing to get it done on the Mac than it took to do it the other way, as I recall. -- David Dyer-Bennet, ; http://dd-b.net/ Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/ Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/ Dragaera: http://dragaera.info |
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