[K-M - Sony] Damn! Now let's move on...

Douglas wrote:
"Skip M" wrote in message
news:24Uzf.12036$sA3.2708@fed1read02...

Moving further on... The fabled and soon to be thrown overboard 580 EX
Speedlite must surely be Canon's main source of embarrasment. This
self opinionated company has seen fit to produce a camera without an
inbuilt flash while at the same time making the hot shoe, so voltage
sensitive that an owner cannot buy flash guns with legendary
capabilities and exposure accuracy Canon have yet to equal (like Metz
CT series) and expect NOT to fry the camera when they connect it.

??
I've connected flash to my Canon DSLRs many many thousands of times...and
have never had a problem...and certainly nothing as you describe.

"Douglas" wrote in message
...

"Skip M" wrote in message
news:24Uzf.12036$sA3.2708@fed1read02...

The 5D is sadly lacking in areas of basic functionality that other
camera makers addressed long ago. Simple things like accurate flash
metering are not part of the 5Ds better points. D200 is the legend of
the future.

Piffle.
Let me clarify that. Flash metering, is, indeed, not a strong point of
any Canon, and a continuing source of frustration for me. But it works
better than the 20D, that's for sure. That is the only weak point in the
armor of the 5D, as far as I'm concerned. It certainly is not lacking in
"certain areas of basic functionality," as is stated here...

--

Happy new year Skip.
So you agree with me once more but still have undying loyalty for the
brand?
By about 1988, Minolta, Yashica, Fuji, Pentax, Nikon and Mamiya had all
mastered the ability to accurately meter exposure on the fly, through the
lens of a 35mm SLR.

Maybe I am missing something here? I would have thought - 18 years on,
that this came under the heading of "basic Functionality". I also though a
camera's ability to meter it's shutter speed or aperture accurately when
you set one of it's "basic functions" - the exposure mode dial to Av or Tv
was also a basic function.
You used the plural, "areaS", "thingS", and that is what I disagree with.
(To be ungrammatical.)

Hey... What about white balance? My Panasonic FZ20 and FZ30 both meter
white balance accurately. I have yet to find a situation that fools them.
Not so with this Gem of the Orient, a Canon 5D, is it? Or is that not
basic functionality either?
Don't have a problem with that. Sorry that you do.

Moving further on... The fabled and soon to be thrown overboard 580 EX
Speedlite must surely be Canon's main source of embarrasment. This self
opinionated company has seen fit to produce a camera without an inbuilt
flash while at the same time making the hot shoe, so voltage sensitive
that an owner cannot buy flash guns with legendary capabilities and
exposure accuracy Canon have yet to equal (like Metz CT series) and expect
NOT to fry the camera when they connect it.

Why would the 580EX be "thrown overboard?" By you, or by Canon. I have had
excellent results with it, as have most everybody else who's used it.
Quantum and Metz have flash adaptors that work on the 5D, just do a little
leg work, Doug.

Good one Canon. You have in one single product alienated more serious
photographers from using Canon cameras than I would care to count. What
ever possessed Canon to market this 'jewel' of mixed perfection and total
crap at the price break they have and still have the cheek to say (in
Australia anyway) that it doesn't qualify as a professional camera and
owners are not eligible for membership to that elite group of
professionals entitled to receive 2 day turnaround on repairs... To name
just one of the benefits now exclusively reserved for owners of 1D series
cameras.

That's a function of your buddies at Canon Au, Canon US doesn't make that
distinction, nor does Canon Eu.

This I could live with if it were not for the fact this camera has as bad,
maybe worse back focus errors than the 20Ds I had before it. Three weeks
to fix it is disturbing in the extreme. I don't have this problem with any
of my (cheaper than a Canon speedlite alone) Olympus E300s.

And most of us don't have that problem, either, Doug. Several of the guys
who posted the problem on DPReview were found to be victims of user/operator
error, not backfocusing. Indeed, though, there seems to be a few with the
problem, but, considering the numbers produced, it seems to be within
tolerance.

I thought (silly me) that the mere fact of a 5D being a full frame sensor,
the back focus issues that plagued their earlier consumer DSLRs would not
be an issue. The bit I have trouble with is not so much the fact they have
"issues". All cameras do. It's the attitude Canon have towards their
customers. Had not my Nikon gear been stolen by a swift footed thief, I
might never have had the misfortune to be fooled (again) by the bull****
and slipshod assembly Canon are rapidly gaining a reputation for.

Again, the attitude thing seems to be Canon Au, Canon US, especially up in
Irvine, CA, seems to be the opposite.

So now my new year grip is over... Got any holiday snaps, Skip?

Happy New Year, to you too, Doug. Used my 20D and Casio EX-Z50 for the
snaps. Got some nice head- and body shots of a model in Dec, but haven't
had time to do much this year, so far, with the 5D. I haven't been this
happy with a camera since my AT-1, more than 20 years ago. Especially after
I found that the vignetting issue with the 15mm fisheye Sigma was a lens
issue, not a sensor issue, odd as it were...
--
Skip Middleton
http://www.shadowcatcherimagery.com

"SMS" wrote in message
...
Skip M wrote:

Let me clarify that. Flash metering, is, indeed, not a strong point of
any Canon, and a continuing source of frustration for me. But it works
better than the 20D, that's for sure. That is the only weak point in the
armor of the 5D, as far as I'm concerned. It certainly is not lacking in
"certain areas of basic functionality," as is stated here...

A lot of the problems stem from a misunderstanding of how E-TTL II works.

Read "http://photonotes.org/articles/eos-flash/"

Yes, many of the problems do. But, after reading that over and over again,
and shooting for a year and a half with E-TTL II, I'd have to say that Canon
screwed the pooch on this one. The way it works best is on manual, which
kinda defeats the purpose of TTL metering, auto flash and program mode on
the camera, now, doesn't it? It has been this way with Canon's TTL flash,
through A-TTL, E-TTL, and now E-TTL II. The 5D is considerably better than
the 20D was, but it still isn't what it should be.

--
Skip Middleton
http://www.shadowcatcherimagery.com

Mark² wrote:
Douglas wrote:

"Skip M" wrote in message
news:24Uzf.12036$sA3.2708@fed1read02...


Moving further on... The fabled and soon to be thrown overboard 580 EX
Speedlite must surely be Canon's main source of embarrasment. This
self opinionated company has seen fit to produce a camera without an
inbuilt flash while at the same time making the hot shoe, so voltage
sensitive that an owner cannot buy flash guns with legendary
capabilities and exposure accuracy Canon have yet to equal (like Metz
CT series) and expect NOT to fry the camera when they connect it.


??
I've connected flash to my Canon DSLRs many many thousands of times...and
have never had a problem...and certainly nothing as you describe.

Er, ah, Douglas, might this be the infamous fry the camera by shooting
in very high temperatures and humidity several hundred exposures in a
row kinda thing? Or, was that quite different?

--
John McWilliams

On 2006-01-19 20:04:53 -0500, "ian lincoln" said:


"Alan Browne" wrote in message
ps.com...
1) I've been anticipating this for the last couple years (and hoping it
would not happen).
Nothing to fear really as my cameras all still work.

2) K-M should at least receive kudos for transferring the Maxxum/Dynax
technology to Sony. Unlike others who have simply exited the business
and left everyone in the lurch.

3) If Sony release an SLR this summer for Maxxum/Dynax lenses, I
suspect it will be based on the same 10 Mpix sensor as the Nikon D200.
Nothing at all wrong with that.

Beyond that...

Hopefully Sony will be strongly inspired by the Maxxum 9, 7 and 7D in
their DSLR designs. This is extremely important to the way I shoot.

Hopefully Sony will employ the Anti-Shake technology as well (not
mentioned in the press release, alas).

Hopefully, Sony will continue with the same flash interface (and
wireless, and so on) as the Maxxum standard ...

Hopefully, Sony remain out of the 4/3 market!

Hopefully Sony will develop Maxxum/Dynax mount lenses... perhaps with
Tamron, perhaps even with Carl Zeiss.

Sony's lens making abilities are impressive when it comes to their
camcorders. Most of their compact cameras have impressive lenses and
their auto everything exposure systems aren't easily fooled. Their
super zooms for the hybrid dslr market are good, considering all the
necessary compromises in design they are good. Sony seem to have stuck
with ccd whereas canon have a proven track record with cmos. Sony have
optical stabilisaton for their camcorders and digicams as well as
software IS for their low end digicams. I think the K-M system would
make a fine addition. The superior handling of K-M designs may conflict
with the small and sleek company ethos rather than the big and chunky
yet functional mantra of K-M. All in all K-M could be in worse hands.

To my knowledge, Sony buys lenses... not manufactures. They may
indeed source fine lenses...

Pentax are with Samsung now and Nikon use Sony CCD. That just leaves
olympus out in the cold. They could do with help from a large
electronics giant. I wonder if panasonic would be interested. Or
perhaps sigma should drop their own bodies and stick to lenses and stay
by olympus.

K-M had the technology but were way too slow to bring it to market and
lost too many devotees who couldn't wait and jumped to canon and nikon.
The product turnover couldn't compete with the juggernaught that is
canon. Canons other businesses could carry a poor performing section
such as the low return on the photobusiness and justify it as a
showcase of canon technologies.

All over the photographic market is contracting. Hassalblad almost
gone. Bronica gone. Ilford in receivership. Kodak pulling out of lab
processing. Agfa limping along. The inkjet papers and minilabs are
going from konica. The retail industry suffering too. Camera phones
biting into compact markets. Ordinary electronic stores competing with
photoretailers. Then the internet price wars. I suspect the remains
of the photomarket will be swallowed by the consumer electronics
stores. There will be more takeovers partnerships and amalgamations as
those still in the business fight to survive over shrinking market.

Which will not be good for any of us.. BTW, I bought a new phone before
Christmas to repalce my lost one.. I am to say, most of the phones in
the Sprint store had no camera.. What a refreshing change from when I
bought last one, when I had no choice but to buy a phone with a crap
camera.

I think I will end up treasuring my old film cameras more than my
digitals. If only I will be able to buy film.

Jim


--
Jim

"And another one gone, and another one gone
Another one bites the dust
Hey, I'm gonna get you too
Another one bites the dust"

On Thu, 19 Jan 2006 19:08:24 -0800, John McWilliams
wrote:

Mark² wrote:
Douglas wrote:

"Skip M" wrote in message
news:24Uzf.12036$sA3.2708@fed1read02...


Moving further on... The fabled and soon to be thrown overboard 580 EX
Speedlite must surely be Canon's main source of embarrasment. This
self opinionated company has seen fit to produce a camera without an
inbuilt flash while at the same time making the hot shoe, so voltage
sensitive that an owner cannot buy flash guns with legendary
capabilities and exposure accuracy Canon have yet to equal (like Metz
CT series) and expect NOT to fry the camera when they connect it.


??
I've connected flash to my Canon DSLRs many many thousands of times...and
have never had a problem...and certainly nothing as you describe.

Er, ah, Douglas, might this be the infamous fry the camera by shooting
in very high temperatures and humidity several hundred exposures in a
row kinda thing? Or, was that quite different?

No, it's a little different.
Many *older( flash units use a high triger voltage. The new DSLRs
expect a lower voltage, and the higher voltage can fry the internals
of the DSLRs.
But those older flashes won't "talk to" the newer cameras, and must be
used in manual mode (or thyristor squelch mode) and are much less
functional than the newer flashes made for digital cameras anyway.

--
Bill Funk
Replace "g" with "a"
funktionality.blogspot.com

ian lincoln wrote:


That just leaves
olympus out in the cold. They could do with help from a large electronics
giant. I wonder if panasonic would be interested.

Guess you missed that press release.
--

Stacey

Skip M wrote:

The 5D is considerably better
than the 20D was, but it still isn't what it should be.


No camera is perfect. The user has to choose what features are important to
them and chose a camera accordingly.

--

Stacey

Alan Browne wrote:

1) I've been anticipating this for the last couple years (and hoping it
would not happen).


And yet people are still ranting that 4/3's is dead?
--

Stacey