Best Photo printer please

On 2013-09-02 14:33:12 -0700, PeterN said:

On 9/2/2013 1:56 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2013.09.02 13:18 , PeterN wrote:
On 9/2/2013 1:01 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2013.09.02 12:48 , iCod wrote:
My Canon ip5000 has died. I need a replacement. Any recomendations
greatfully received. Ink replacement price is an important issue.

Pro photo printers give you the best ink cost - about 1 ¢ per square
inch

Example: Epson 3880. It has a new cost of about $1300 - but that
includes a full set of 100% full 80 ml ink cartridges (that's about $500
worth of ink). So in reality it is a $800 printer. Those large
cartridges are more expensive (about $50 - $55 per cart) but they
contain far more ink than the 15ml carts that you pay $20 - $30 for.

Common ink jet printers (such as you would get at Staples) with scanner
and fax integration, are about 2 - 4 times more expensive in ink costs -
but the up front cost is very low ($100 or less).

Kodak claimed that their personal use printers, while more expensive ,
had lower ink costs that most ink jets. I do not know if that bears out
in real life.


Your suggestion is for an excellent high quality printer. And indeed if
I decide to do fine art printing, it is the one I would purchase.

If the OP is more concerned about ink costs than quality, he should
consider any printer for which he is able to get third party ink. We
don't know what size images he is seeking to make, and the quantity of
printing he does, therefore, it is difficult to make a recommendation.

I assume that anyone making photo prints wants photo quality ink and not
the hit or miss of 3rd party inks.

Pro printers such as the 3880 (I have the predecessor 3800 which uses
the same ink carts except one) are designed for high throughput (not
that I do high volume). So the ink quality is superior and the cost per
print is far lower than common inkjets. At a lower capital cost and
slightly higher ink cost is the printer that the duck mentioned.


Some third party inks are superb. But, unless you have inside
knowledge, you really don't know what you are getting.
However, we really don't know the OP's requirements.

I think the clue to his requirements lies in the printer he is trying
to replace, a Canon ip5000, which is a $200 general purpose printer of
2005 vintage. It does a fair enough job for most photo printing, but it
is not in the same league as the "Pro" level photo printers from the
Canon & Epson stables. I could be wrong, but I don't think he is moving
to upgrade to a premium printer in the $700-$1800 range.

So I think the Epson R3880, R2880, or the Canon Pixma Pro printers are
not what he is looking for.

In the $200-$300 price range, I would seriously take a look at one of
the Epson Artisan printers such as the Epson Artisan 1430.
http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/j...sku=C11CB53201
http://www.photographyblog.com/revie...n_1430_review/

Then both Canon & Epson have multi-purpose "all-in-one" printers which
might meet his needs for under $200.


--
Regards,

Savageduck

On 2013.09.02 17:33 , PeterN wrote:

Some third party inks are superb. But, unless you have inside knowledge,
you really don't know what you are getting.

It would be folly to use 3rd party inks in my photo printer. It took
quite a while to get my color control process clear.

I use 3rd party inks in my Canon home office printer - but then I don't
care how colour looks coming out of it.

However, we really don't know the OP's requirements.

Too true - and he hasn't replied with more details.

I did eventually bother to look up what he's replacing and so I somehow
doubt he's in the market for a 3880 or other high end printer.


--
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of **** by the clean end."
-Unknown

On 9/2/2013 6:19 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On 2013-09-02 14:33:12 -0700, PeterN said:

On 9/2/2013 1:56 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2013.09.02 13:18 , PeterN wrote:
On 9/2/2013 1:01 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2013.09.02 12:48 , iCod wrote:
My Canon ip5000 has died. I need a replacement. Any recomendations
greatfully received. Ink replacement price is an important issue.

Pro photo printers give you the best ink cost - about 1 ¢ per square
inch

Example: Epson 3880. It has a new cost of about $1300 - but that
includes a full set of 100% full 80 ml ink cartridges (that's about
$500
worth of ink). So in reality it is a $800 printer. Those large
cartridges are more expensive (about $50 - $55 per cart) but they
contain far more ink than the 15ml carts that you pay $20 - $30 for.

Common ink jet printers (such as you would get at Staples) with
scanner
and fax integration, are about 2 - 4 times more expensive in ink
costs -
but the up front cost is very low ($100 or less).

Kodak claimed that their personal use printers, while more expensive ,
had lower ink costs that most ink jets. I do not know if that
bears out
in real life.


Your suggestion is for an excellent high quality printer. And indeed if
I decide to do fine art printing, it is the one I would purchase.

If the OP is more concerned about ink costs than quality, he should
consider any printer for which he is able to get third party ink. We
don't know what size images he is seeking to make, and the quantity of
printing he does, therefore, it is difficult to make a recommendation.

I assume that anyone making photo prints wants photo quality ink and not
the hit or miss of 3rd party inks.

Pro printers such as the 3880 (I have the predecessor 3800 which uses
the same ink carts except one) are designed for high throughput (not
that I do high volume). So the ink quality is superior and the cost per
print is far lower than common inkjets. At a lower capital cost and
slightly higher ink cost is the printer that the duck mentioned.


Some third party inks are superb. But, unless you have inside
knowledge, you really don't know what you are getting.
However, we really don't know the OP's requirements.

I think the clue to his requirements lies in the printer he is trying to
replace, a Canon ip5000, which is a $200 general purpose printer of 2005
vintage. It does a fair enough job for most photo printing, but it is
not in the same league as the "Pro" level photo printers from the Canon
& Epson stables. I could be wrong, but I don't think he is moving to
upgrade to a premium printer in the $700-$1800 range.

So I think the Epson R3880, R2880, or the Canon Pixma Pro printers are
not what he is looking for.

In the $200-$300 price range, I would seriously take a look at one of
the Epson Artisan printers such as the Epson Artisan 1430.
http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/j...sku=C11CB53201
http://www.photographyblog.com/revie...n_1430_review/

Then both Canon & Epson have multi-purpose "all-in-one" printers which
might meet his needs for under $200.



Yeah! That's what I originally thought. Is this a different printer?
http://www.amazon.com/Canon-PIXMA-iP5000-Photo-Printer/dp/B0002F9Y0A


--
PeterN

On 2013-09-02 14:44:39 -0700, PeterN said:

On 9/2/2013 3:46 PM, Eric Stevens wrote:


snip


The OP should not ignore the cost of photoquality paper. Larger sheets
are often cheaper than smaller (e.g. A3+ is cheaper than A3) and this
should be borne in mind when considering printer size. I went through
this exercise about three years ago and, like PeterN, I ended up
buying an Epson 3800. I could have bought a cheaper printer but by the
time I had bought my first set of replacement ink cartridges it had
already cost me less to run than if I had bought a smaller R2800 (I
think it was then).


Minor correction. I do not own any photo printer. I do all my printing
at Costco. But, as I said, for me a 3880 would be my choice of printers.
For lower ink prices one would do well with the 4880, but unless the
OP did a high volume, ink clogging would become a problem.

Looking at the printer the OP is looking to replace, the Canon ip5000,
I agree that a printing service such as Costco, sharing sites with
print services such as SmugMug, would be the most economical way to go,
if more than the occasional print is needed.

With my R2880 I produce a handful of prints monthly, on 13''x19'',
11''x17'', and 11''x14'' Red River, UltraPro Gloss, Polar Pearl
Metallic, and Arctic Polar Satin papers with great results. If my print
numbers were higher I would lean toward an R3880. I have not had any
ink clogging issues with my low volume print runs. I can't say the same
for my Canon i9900 or my old ink wasting, jet clogger, Epson 870.

That said I think the OP would be happy replacing his ip5000 with a
more contemporary general purpose photo printer in the $150-$300 range,
and farm out any bulk print orders.
My recommendation in that case would be one of the Epson Artisan printers.

--
Regards,

Savageduck

On 2013-09-02 15:48:52 -0700, PeterN said:

On 9/2/2013 6:19 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On 2013-09-02 14:33:12 -0700, PeterN said:

On 9/2/2013 1:56 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2013.09.02 13:18 , PeterN wrote:
On 9/2/2013 1:01 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2013.09.02 12:48 , iCod wrote:
My Canon ip5000 has died. I need a replacement. Any recomendations
greatfully received. Ink replacement price is an important issue.

Pro photo printers give you the best ink cost - about 1 ¢ per square
inch

Example: Epson 3880. It has a new cost of about $1300 - but that
includes a full set of 100% full 80 ml ink cartridges (that's about
$500
worth of ink). So in reality it is a $800 printer. Those large
cartridges are more expensive (about $50 - $55 per cart) but they
contain far more ink than the 15ml carts that you pay $20 - $30 for.

Common ink jet printers (such as you would get at Staples) with
scanner
and fax integration, are about 2 - 4 times more expensive in ink
costs -
but the up front cost is very low ($100 or less).

Kodak claimed that their personal use printers, while more expensive ,
had lower ink costs that most ink jets. I do not know if that
bears out
in real life.


Your suggestion is for an excellent high quality printer. And indeed if
I decide to do fine art printing, it is the one I would purchase.

If the OP is more concerned about ink costs than quality, he should
consider any printer for which he is able to get third party ink. We
don't know what size images he is seeking to make, and the quantity of
printing he does, therefore, it is difficult to make a recommendation.

I assume that anyone making photo prints wants photo quality ink and not
the hit or miss of 3rd party inks.

Pro printers such as the 3880 (I have the predecessor 3800 which uses
the same ink carts except one) are designed for high throughput (not
that I do high volume). So the ink quality is superior and the cost per
print is far lower than common inkjets. At a lower capital cost and
slightly higher ink cost is the printer that the duck mentioned.


Some third party inks are superb. But, unless you have inside
knowledge, you really don't know what you are getting.
However, we really don't know the OP's requirements.

I think the clue to his requirements lies in the printer he is trying to
replace, a Canon ip5000, which is a $200 general purpose printer of 2005
vintage. It does a fair enough job for most photo printing, but it is
not in the same league as the "Pro" level photo printers from the Canon
& Epson stables. I could be wrong, but I don't think he is moving to
upgrade to a premium printer in the $700-$1800 range.

So I think the Epson R3880, R2880, or the Canon Pixma Pro printers are
not what he is looking for.

In the $200-$300 price range, I would seriously take a look at one of
the Epson Artisan printers such as the Epson Artisan 1430.
http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/j...sku=C11CB53201
http://www.photographyblog.com/revie...n_1430_review/

Then both Canon & Epson have multi-purpose "all-in-one" printers which
might meet his needs for under $200.



Yeah! That's what I originally thought. Is this a different printer?
http://www.amazon.com/Canon-PIXMA-iP5000-Photo-Printer/dp/B0002F9Y0A

That is his printer which had an MSRP of $199. It is a discontinued
2005 model, so none of those Amazon vendor prices are realistic. He can
do better today.


--
Regards,

Savageduck

On 9/2/2013 6:25 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2013.09.02 17:33 , PeterN wrote:

Some third party inks are superb. But, unless you have inside knowledge,
you really don't know what you are getting.

It would be folly to use 3rd party inks in my photo printer. It took
quite a while to get my color control process clear.

Yup! You would have to recalibrate for the colors. We had a reliable ink
supplier here, who supplied very high quality inks, at prices that were
about 1/3 of OEM, but Epson put him out of business.



I use 3rd party inks in my Canon home office printer - but then I don't
care how colour looks coming out of it.

However, we really don't know the OP's requirements.

Too true - and he hasn't replied with more details.

I did eventually bother to look up what he's replacing and so I somehow
doubt he's in the market for a 3880 or other high end printer.




--
PeterN

On 9/2/2013 6:50 PM, Savageduck wrote:
On 2013-09-02 14:44:39 -0700, PeterN said:

On 9/2/2013 3:46 PM, Eric Stevens wrote:


snip


The OP should not ignore the cost of photoquality paper. Larger sheets
are often cheaper than smaller (e.g. A3+ is cheaper than A3) and this
should be borne in mind when considering printer size. I went through
this exercise about three years ago and, like PeterN, I ended up
buying an Epson 3800. I could have bought a cheaper printer but by the
time I had bought my first set of replacement ink cartridges it had
already cost me less to run than if I had bought a smaller R2800 (I
think it was then).


Minor correction. I do not own any photo printer. I do all my printing
at Costco. But, as I said, for me a 3880 would be my choice of printers.
For lower ink prices one would do well with the 4880, but unless the
OP did a high volume, ink clogging would become a problem.

Looking at the printer the OP is looking to replace, the Canon ip5000, I
agree that a printing service such as Costco, sharing sites with print
services such as SmugMug, would be the most economical way to go, if
more than the occasional print is needed.

With my R2880 I produce a handful of prints monthly, on 13''x19'',
11''x17'', and 11''x14'' Red River, UltraPro Gloss, Polar Pearl
Metallic, and Arctic Polar Satin papers with great results. If my print
numbers were higher I would lean toward an R3880. I have not had any ink
clogging issues with my low volume print runs. I can't say the same for
my Canon i9900 or my old ink wasting, jet clogger, Epson 870.

That said I think the OP would be happy replacing his ip5000 with a more
contemporary general purpose photo printer in the $150-$300 range, and
farm out any bulk print orders.
My recommendation in that case would be one of the Epson Artisan printers.


We had an Artisan all in one that just decided to stop working. the
error message was that the feeder was jammed. Noting was jammed in that
machine. Epson said it was a bad sensor. It was cheaper to replace the
machine that fix the sensor. (I replaced it with an HP laser all in one.)


--
PeterN

On 2013.09.02 18:56 , PeterN wrote:
On 9/2/2013 6:25 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2013.09.02 17:33 , PeterN wrote:

Some third party inks are superb. But, unless you have inside knowledge,
you really don't know what you are getting.

It would be folly to use 3rd party inks in my photo printer. It took
quite a while to get my color control process clear.

Yup! You would have to recalibrate for the colors. We had a reliable ink
supplier here, who supplied very high quality inks, at prices that were
about 1/3 of OEM, but Epson put him out of business.

Not just recalibrate for 3rd party. But recalibrate every time a cart
was changed. In my printer that's 5 colour and 4 black carts.


--
"Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional,
illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media,
which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible
to pick up a piece of **** by the clean end."
-Unknown

On 9/2/2013 7:12 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2013.09.02 18:56 , PeterN wrote:
On 9/2/2013 6:25 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2013.09.02 17:33 , PeterN wrote:

Some third party inks are superb. But, unless you have inside
knowledge,
you really don't know what you are getting.

It would be folly to use 3rd party inks in my photo printer. It took
quite a while to get my color control process clear.

Yup! You would have to recalibrate for the colors. We had a reliable ink
supplier here, who supplied very high quality inks, at prices that were
about 1/3 of OEM, but Epson put him out of business.

Not just recalibrate for 3rd party. But recalibrate every time a cart
was changed. In my printer that's 5 colour and 4 black carts.



Lack of consistency is a known issue with third party ink suppliers.


--
PeterN