Why current silver DSLRs make people want to vomit

RichA wrote:
On Aug 5, 12:33 pm, Alan Browne
wrote:
RichA wrote:
My guess is Canon may release a pro body like this in CARBON fiber at
some point, but weight has its advantages so metal as usual, is still
by far the best choice.
Carbon fibre is more difficult to form into complex shapes than
polycarb, so high quality polycarb will remain the plastic of choice for
bodies.

Carbon fibre is a better choice for tripod legs which are straight and
benefit directly from the longitudinal stiffness and lateral damping.

Not that we haven't mentioned this to you before.

Difficult, but not impossible to form into complex shapes.

Much more expensive than plastic.

If the
layers can be pressure stamped into shape, they will be. Also, I like

That's not how carbon fibre complex shapes are made. They are made
layer by layer on a form and then pressure cured. For irregular forms
it is not at all conducive to automation. Plastics are typically
injection molded which is a much cheaper process. Esp for camera bodies
which can have elaborate internal moldings to support parts, provide
via's for wires, channels for moving parts, etc ... doing such detail
work in carbon fiber would be much more expensive than an all metal body.

your use of the qualifying term, "high quality" polycarbonate. You
have no idea what quality they use in cameras, you simply added that
to add weight to the idea plastic is "good" to use in a camera body.
All the adjectives in the english language won't change the fact
plastic is a money saving material implemented to raise profit margins
and keep prices below a certain level.

"Hybrid (metal/high-impact polycarbonate) case. - Grip half of the case
is magnesium, lens side appears to be high-impact polycarbonate." -Nikon

"The Evolt E-330 is constructed of high-impact polycarbonate plastic
over a durable steel chassis. It measures 140 x 87 x 72 mm / 5.5" x 3.4"
x 2.8" (WHD)." -Olympus

"and the camera looks quite professional in its black high-impact
polycarbonate body." -- review of a Fujifilm camera...

etc.

Compared to the NRE and setup costs, the choice of high quality
poly-carb over lower quality is negligeable. What is a useful cost
saving for a child's $2.00 toy is not worth the lowered quality for even
a $200 film body.

As there is a market for such things and it opens up photography to more
users, why not?

You can keep up your mindless prattle but it does not make polycarbonate
body cameras evil in any way other than for those who expose themselves
and their gear to truly harsh conditions.

--
-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
-- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
-- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch.

"RichA" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Aug 5, 9:31 am, "Spinoza" wrote:
"frederick" wrote in message

news:1186007353.245097@ftpsrv1...



JoeT wrote:

"RichA" wrote in message
groups.com...
The Rebel and Rebel XT. Very rare Nikon D50s and Olympus E-500s.
What they all share is a stigma in cameras that in humans is akin to
leprosy. Silvered plastic. It looks so awful and cheezy that only
the lowest forms of life (bottom barrel pocketable P&Ss) wear it like
a badge of honour.
However, mark my words. If Canon or Nikon released a metal bodied
DSLR with a silver finish like the old FE or AE-1s SLRs, it would
cause a sensation. IMO, it could possibly outsell black.

Why on earth would anyone spend more than a scant second of time
concerned with such mundane issues as color choices of plastic bodied
cameras?
At the price point, you like silver, get it, you like black, get it.
What
mature individual give a rats ass what anyone superficially thinks in
this regard?

I'm with RichA on this.
If you're taking photos of people, it does make a difference as they
won't
take you seriously if you're obviously using a silver camera that looks
like a toy. You can dismiss this as fantasy if you like, but you are
wrong. If you aren't taking photos of people, then it doesn't matter a
rat's arse.

Would a black M16 would kill better than one spray painted in silver? The
enemy won't take a silver M16 seriously but the projectile would shoot
akin
to the black one. Perhaps then the silver M16 would have a higher kill
ratio
as the enemy would pause and gawk and get killed in mid laugh. But I
suppose
a black M16 would have a more authoritarian, swatty, control and scare
the
sheeple effect, and have a black matte nastiness about it.. making the
enemy cringe and shots get missed. But black is kewl, even to the point
of
catching the eye of rent a cops and other authority figures stopping you
on
the street with your phallic black camera.

Your pink 30D is on it's way to your.

Thanks, I'll hide it behind a 600mm f4/L. :P

On Wed, 01 Aug 2007 12:22:08 -0700, RichA wrote:
: On Aug 1, 3:08 pm, (Paul Mitchum) wrote:
: RichA wrote:
: The Rebel and Rebel XT. Very rare Nikon D50s and Olympus E-500s.
: What they all share is a stigma in cameras that in humans is akin to
: leprosy. Silvered plastic. It looks so awful and cheezy that only
: the lowest forms of life (bottom barrel pocketable P&Ss) wear it like
: a badge of honour.
: However, mark my words. If Canon or Nikon released a metal bodied
: DSLR with a silver finish like the old FE or AE-1s SLRs, it would
: cause a sensation. IMO, it could possibly outsell black.
:
: http://www.dpreview.com/news/0706/07060101pentax50thdslr.asp
:
: --http://www.xoverboard.com/cartoons/2007/070416_argument.html
:
: Better, but still silvered plastic. Sad, when you consider even the
: lowliest Pentax SLR (K1000 $129.body when it left production) was
: metal shelled.

A film camera has more moving parts, and therefore more components under
mechanical stress, than a digital camera has. Maybe that makes plastic
unsuitable.

Bob

On Thu, 02 Aug 2007 10:34:55 +1200, frederick wrote:
: JoeT wrote:
:
: "RichA" wrote in message
: oups.com...
: The Rebel and Rebel XT. Very rare Nikon D50s and Olympus E-500s.
: What they all share is a stigma in cameras that in humans is akin to
: leprosy. Silvered plastic. It looks so awful and cheezy that only
: the lowest forms of life (bottom barrel pocketable P&Ss) wear it like
: a badge of honour.
: However, mark my words. If Canon or Nikon released a metal bodied
: DSLR with a silver finish like the old FE or AE-1s SLRs, it would
: cause a sensation. IMO, it could possibly outsell black.
:
:
: Why on earth would anyone spend more than a scant second of time
: concerned with such mundane issues as color choices of plastic bodied
: cameras?
: At the price point, you like silver, get it, you like black, get it.
: What mature individual give a rats ass what anyone superficially thinks
: in this regard?
:
:
: I'm with RichA on this.
: If you're taking photos of people, it does make a difference as they
: won't take you seriously if you're obviously using a silver camera that
: looks like a toy. You can dismiss this as fantasy if you like, but you
: are wrong. If you aren't taking photos of people, then it doesn't
: matter a rat's arse.

What (other than Rich's goofy prattle) makes you think a silver camera looks
like a toy? My daughter's kids have a toy digital camera, and it's either
yellow or pink. (I forget which.) It most definitely isn't silver.

Bob

Robert Coe wrote:
On Thu, 02 Aug 2007 10:34:55 +1200, frederick wrote:
: JoeT wrote:
:
: "RichA" wrote in message
: oups.com...
: The Rebel and Rebel XT. Very rare Nikon D50s and Olympus E-500s.
: What they all share is a stigma in cameras that in humans is akin to
: leprosy. Silvered plastic. It looks so awful and cheezy that only
: the lowest forms of life (bottom barrel pocketable P&Ss) wear it like
: a badge of honour.
: However, mark my words. If Canon or Nikon released a metal bodied
: DSLR with a silver finish like the old FE or AE-1s SLRs, it would
: cause a sensation. IMO, it could possibly outsell black.
:
:
: Why on earth would anyone spend more than a scant second of time
: concerned with such mundane issues as color choices of plastic bodied
: cameras?
: At the price point, you like silver, get it, you like black, get it.
: What mature individual give a rats ass what anyone superficially thinks
: in this regard?
:
:
: I'm with RichA on this.
: If you're taking photos of people, it does make a difference as they
: won't take you seriously if you're obviously using a silver camera that
: looks like a toy. You can dismiss this as fantasy if you like, but you
: are wrong. If you aren't taking photos of people, then it doesn't
: matter a rat's arse.

What (other than Rich's goofy prattle) makes you think a silver camera looks
like a toy? My daughter's kids have a toy digital camera, and it's either
yellow or pink. (I forget which.) It most definitely isn't silver.

Bob

If "pros" had used almost exclusively pink cameras for the past 20
years, then black cameras would probably look like toys...
Nah - IMO some things just should be a certain colour. Perhaps
generation Y will want interchangeable coloured skins for the cameras -
an opportunity to express their creativity and individuality through
over-consumption of mass-produced techno toys.

On Aug 5, 9:31 am, "Spinoza" wrote:
"frederick" wrote in message

news:1186007353.245097@ftpsrv1...



JoeT wrote:

"RichA" wrote in message
groups.com...
The Rebel and Rebel XT. Very rare Nikon D50s and Olympus E-500s.
What they all share is a stigma in cameras that in humans is akin to
leprosy. Silvered plastic. It looks so awful and cheezy that only
the lowest forms of life (bottom barrel pocketable P&Ss) wear it like
a badge of honour.
However, mark my words. If Canon or Nikon released a metal bodied
DSLR with a silver finish like the old FE or AE-1s SLRs, it would
cause a sensation. IMO, it could possibly outsell black.

Why on earth would anyone spend more than a scant second of time
concerned with such mundane issues as color choices of plastic bodied
cameras?
At the price point, you like silver, get it, you like black, get it. What
mature individual give a rats ass what anyone superficially thinks in
this regard?

I'm with RichA on this.
If you're taking photos of people, it does make a difference as they won't
take you seriously if you're obviously using a silver camera that looks
like a toy. You can dismiss this as fantasy if you like, but you are
wrong. If you aren't taking photos of people, then it doesn't matter a
rat's arse.

Would a black M16 would kill better than one spray painted in silver? The
enemy won't take a silver M16 seriously but the projectile would shoot akin
to the black one. Perhaps then the silver M16 would have a higher kill ratio
as the enemy would pause and gawk and get killed in mid laugh. But I suppose
a black M16 would have a more authoritarian, swatty, control and scare the
sheeple effect, and have a black matte nastiness about it.. making the
enemy cringe and shots get missed. But black is kewl, even to the point of
catching the eye of rent a cops and other authority figures stopping you on
the street with your phallic black camera.

The rationale for a matte black weapon is simple: it doesn't reflect
light to give away a person's position, also the reason such rifles
use flash suppressors. In my understanding, possibly misunderstanding,
something like 40 years ago, black created fewer reflections in many
types of photos, thus was preferred by pros.

On Aug 7, 12:50 am, frederick wrote:
Robert Coe wrote:
On Thu, 02 Aug 2007 10:34:55 +1200, frederick wrote:
: JoeT wrote:
:
: "RichA" wrote in message
: roups.com...
: The Rebel and Rebel XT. Very rare Nikon D50s and Olympus E-500s.
: What they all share is a stigma in cameras that in humans is akin to
: leprosy. Silvered plastic. It looks so awful and cheezy that only
: the lowest forms of life (bottom barrel pocketable P&Ss) wear it like
: a badge of honour.
: However, mark my words. If Canon or Nikon released a metal bodied
: DSLR with a silver finish like the old FE or AE-1s SLRs, it would
: cause a sensation. IMO, it could possibly outsell black.
:
:
: Why on earth would anyone spend more than a scant second of time
: concerned with such mundane issues as color choices of plastic bodied
: cameras?
: At the price point, you like silver, get it, you like black, get it.
: What mature individual give a rats ass what anyone superficially thinks
: in this regard?
:
:
: I'm with RichA on this.
: If you're taking photos of people, it does make a difference as they
: won't take you seriously if you're obviously using a silver camera that
: looks like a toy. You can dismiss this as fantasy if you like, but you
: are wrong. If you aren't taking photos of people, then it doesn't
: matter a rat's arse.

What (other than Rich's goofy prattle) makes you think a silver camera looks
like a toy? My daughter's kids have a toy digital camera, and it's either
yellow or pink. (I forget which.) It most definitely isn't silver.

Bob

If "pros" had used almost exclusively pink cameras for the past 20
years, then black cameras would probably look like toys...
Nah - IMO some things just should be a certain colour. Perhaps
generation Y will want interchangeable coloured skins for the cameras -
an opportunity to express their creativity and individuality through
over-consumption of mass-produced techno toys.

Y-gen wants nothing to do with individuality.
They are as conformist as Patrick Bateman in "American Psycho."

On 2007-08-01 00:38:43 -0400, RichA said:

The Rebel and Rebel XT. Very rare Nikon D50s and Olympus E-500s.
What they all share is a stigma in cameras that in humans is akin to
leprosy. Silvered plastic. It looks so awful and cheezy that only
the lowest forms of life (bottom barrel pocketable P&Ss) wear it like
a badge of honour.
However, mark my words. If Canon or Nikon released a metal bodied
DSLR with a silver finish like the old FE or AE-1s SLRs, it would
cause a sensation. IMO, it could possibly outsell black.

It would also cost somewhere in the xxxx US Dollar market. Nothing wrong w
ih modern plastics. No, I wouldn't buy one silver colored. While my
1971 Nikon Ftn is solid metal, it has some wear spots but it is still a
fine camera and does everything a film camera needs to be able to do.
Look at this way, my D70s is already out of date. I don't need my
digital cameras to be made of solid metal. The technology dates so
fast. In another year this camera will be dumpster foder. who cares if
only last 5 years. My Nikon F still does what it does, transports
film, fires the shutter at an accurate speed and takes full advantage
of the best film I can buy today. My N90s does this and then some. My
D70s can not take advantage of the best compact flash cards, and no
mater what I do is still a 6 megapixel. I like the camera, don't get
me wrong. But, I am an amatuer, I will never kill a plastic... even a
cheap plastic (which the D70s is not) camera before its technology is
so far outdated that it becomes a door stop. Which is why I, as an
amatuer, would never buy a Leica digital nor a Nikon (or Canon) pro
camera. It may last forever, but after a couple of years, well, the
guy with the 300 buck Panasonic can out perform you. Its different
for the pro's, they use the cameras day and day out. Perhaps they do
wear them out. If the camera lasts a couple of years and works great.
It's a deductible expense and you buy a new one.
Jim

On Tue, 07 Aug 2007 19:38:43 -0000, Charlie Self wrote:
: On Aug 5, 9:31 am, "Spinoza" wrote:
: "frederick" wrote in message
:
: news:1186007353.245097@ftpsrv1...
:
:
:
: JoeT wrote:
:
: "RichA" wrote in message
: groups.com...
: The Rebel and Rebel XT. Very rare Nikon D50s and Olympus E-500s.
: What they all share is a stigma in cameras that in humans is akin to
: leprosy. Silvered plastic. It looks so awful and cheezy that only
: the lowest forms of life (bottom barrel pocketable P&Ss) wear it like
: a badge of honour.
: However, mark my words. If Canon or Nikon released a metal bodied
: DSLR with a silver finish like the old FE or AE-1s SLRs, it would
: cause a sensation. IMO, it could possibly outsell black.
:
: Why on earth would anyone spend more than a scant second of time
: concerned with such mundane issues as color choices of plastic bodied
: cameras?
: At the price point, you like silver, get it, you like black, get it. What
: mature individual give a rats ass what anyone superficially thinks in
: this regard?
:
: I'm with RichA on this.
: If you're taking photos of people, it does make a difference as they won't
: take you seriously if you're obviously using a silver camera that looks
: like a toy. You can dismiss this as fantasy if you like, but you are
: wrong. If you aren't taking photos of people, then it doesn't matter a
: rat's arse.
:
: Would a black M16 would kill better than one spray painted in silver? The
: enemy won't take a silver M16 seriously but the projectile would shoot akin
: to the black one. Perhaps then the silver M16 would have a higher kill ratio
: as the enemy would pause and gawk and get killed in mid laugh. But I suppose
: a black M16 would have a more authoritarian, swatty, control and scare the
: sheeple effect, and have a black matte nastiness about it.. making the
: enemy cringe and shots get missed. But black is kewl, even to the point of
: catching the eye of rent a cops and other authority figures stopping you on
: the street with your phallic black camera.
:
: The rationale for a matte black weapon is simple: it doesn't reflect
: light to give away a person's position, also the reason such rifles
: use flash suppressors. In my understanding, possibly misunderstanding,
: something like 40 years ago, black created fewer reflections in many
: types of photos, thus was preferred by pros.

The rationale given for the first all-black 35mm camera (which, if I remember
correctly, was an extra-cost version of the Nikon S-3) was that by reflecting
less light, it made the photographer less conspicuous. I'm not sure that
anybody (with the possible exception of closeup nature photographers) actually
bought that argument, but it eventually became faddish to buy the black
version. Fads come and go, especially in the black/silver world; you can see
it in products as diverse as automobiles, cell phones, laptop computers, and,
of course, cameras. The only thing of which we can be fairly certain is that
for every major swing in one direction, there will eventually be a swing back
in the other direction. If we wait long enough, we may see Rich dismissing
black cameras as "toys".

Bob

Alan Browne wrote:

My guess is Canon may release a pro body like this in CARBON fiber at
some point, but weight has its advantages so metal as usual, is still
by far the best choice.

Carbon fibre is more difficult to form into complex shapes than
polycarb, so high quality polycarb will remain the plastic of choice for
bodies.

Metal expands and contracts more than plastic does when temperature
changes, and it's also a better conductor of heat in the first place.
Does this have any implications for lenses?

Daniele