color fidelity of digital cameras and a way to test for it

I am interested in how good current digital cameras are as regards
color fidelity. I think the image examples of different cameras which
are to be found on enthousiasts' Web sites are poorly thought out. For
example, one might see various versions of the same landscape or a
face. What is the point of that without the original face illuminated
by the same light to compare the reproductions to? What are they
thinking of?

I propose the following experiment. Take a picture of the cover of this
week's Time magazine in color corrected light and put the file online
for downloading. The downloader prints the file at the default setting,
without "correcting" the colors, on high quality glossy photo paper
using a good quality printer in good working order. She then compares
the print to HER copy of that issue of Time magazine, viewing the print
and the magazine with color corrected light.

Different folks with different digital cameras could post their images
of the cover of the same issue of a popular magazine. If effected, this
test would be a great help in choosing a camera.
by demonstrating comparative color fidelity among the various models.
Time and Newsweek often have color photos on their cover. Perhaps there
is some popular magazine with the same cover every week and which
features a useful variety of colors, but I can't think of any.

Thanks in advance for your consideration of my proposal.

Mike Eisenstadt
Austin, Texas

wrote in message
ups.com...
I am interested in how good current digital cameras are as regards
color fidelity. I think the image examples of different cameras which
are to be found on enthousiasts' Web sites are poorly thought out. For
example, one might see various versions of the same landscape or a
face. What is the point of that without the original face illuminated
by the same light to compare the reproductions to? What are they
thinking of?

I propose the following experiment. Take a picture of the cover of this
week's Time magazine in color corrected light and put the file online
for downloading. The downloader prints the file at the default setting,
without "correcting" the colors, on high quality glossy photo paper
using a good quality printer in good working order. She then compares
the print to HER copy of that issue of Time magazine, viewing the print
and the magazine with color corrected light.

Different folks with different digital cameras could post their images
of the cover of the same issue of a popular magazine. If effected, this
test would be a great help in choosing a camera.
by demonstrating comparative color fidelity among the various models.
Time and Newsweek often have color photos on their cover. Perhaps there
is some popular magazine with the same cover every week and which
features a useful variety of colors, but I can't think of any.

What makes you think that the cover of a magazine can act as a standard?
Kodak, and others, offer standards for tests such as these (but they ain't
cheap).

Not trying to trash your idea, by the way, as it is an important issue.

Charles Schuler wrote:
wrote in message
ups.com...

I am interested in how good current digital cameras are as regards
color fidelity. I think the image examples of different cameras which
are to be found on enthousiasts' Web sites are poorly thought out. For
example, one might see various versions of the same landscape or a
face. What is the point of that without the original face illuminated
by the same light to compare the reproductions to? What are they
thinking of?

I propose the following experiment. Take a picture of the cover of this
week's Time magazine in color corrected light and put the file online
for downloading. The downloader prints the file at the default setting,
without "correcting" the colors, on high quality glossy photo paper
using a good quality printer in good working order. She then compares
the print to HER copy of that issue of Time magazine, viewing the print
and the magazine with color corrected light.

Different folks with different digital cameras could post their images
of the cover of the same issue of a popular magazine. If effected, this
test would be a great help in choosing a camera.
by demonstrating comparative color fidelity among the various models.
Time and Newsweek often have color photos on their cover. Perhaps there
is some popular magazine with the same cover every week and which
features a useful variety of colors, but I can't think of any.


What makes you think that the cover of a magazine can act as a standard?
Kodak, and others, offer standards for tests such as these (but they ain't
cheap).

Not trying to trash your idea, by the way, as it is an important issue.



Even in a camera such as the Canon 20D, color fidelity with the auto
white balance is problematic. I have been using Rawshooter to select an
appropriate color temperature for critical shots. This software also
allows one to apply the same settings to multiple photos. You can
download an eval at http://www.pixmantec.com/

Aside from online viewing, various color printers will handle your
camera file differently. White House Custom Color, a digital photography
service, assists the photographer in getting consistent print output. Go
to www.whcc.com for info. Dry Creek Photo has information on getting
good results with various commercial print machines including the Fuji
Frontier, used by Wal-Mart photo departments.

I don't work for these companies but have found their information useful.

Chip Gallo
www.flickr.com/photos/chipgallo

wrote in message
ups.com...
I am interested in how good current digital cameras are as regards
color fidelity. I think the image examples of different cameras which
are to be found on enthousiasts' Web sites are poorly thought out. For
example, one might see various versions of the same landscape or a
face. What is the point of that without the original face illuminated
by the same light to compare the reproductions to? What are they
thinking of?

There are online comparisons that include standard color charts.

I propose the following experiment. Take a picture of the cover of this
week's Time magazine in color corrected light and put the file online
for downloading.

The magazine is printed at many different locations all over the country at
the same time, so it can appear different. Further, fidelity can change
during a run. And how do you expect the novice to know if his lighting is
color corrected, or even what color the daylight might be?

wrote:
I am interested in how good current digital cameras are as regards
color fidelity. I think the image examples of different cameras which
are to be found on enthousiasts' Web sites are poorly thought out. For
example, one might see various versions of the same landscape or a
face. What is the point of that without the original face illuminated
by the same light to compare the reproductions to? What are they
thinking of?

I propose the following experiment. Take a picture of the cover of this
week's Time magazine in color corrected light and put the file online
for downloading. The downloader prints the file at the default setting,
without "correcting" the colors, on high quality glossy photo paper
using a good quality printer in good working order. She then compares
the print to HER copy of that issue of Time magazine, viewing the print
and the magazine with color corrected light.

Different folks with different digital cameras could post their images
of the cover of the same issue of a popular magazine. If effected, this
test would be a great help in choosing a camera.
by demonstrating comparative color fidelity among the various models.
Time and Newsweek often have color photos on their cover. Perhaps there
is some popular magazine with the same cover every week and which
features a useful variety of colors, but I can't think of any.

The problem is that most cameras are way more accurate then most
printers.

Scott

Why do you need a standard? The notion is to compare the color
fidelity of a reproduction of something to the colors of the original
it is a reproduction of. The quality, good or bad, of the original
photo or how it appears on the cover is besides the point.

I recommended using the cover of a popular magazine so that anyone
almost anywhere can procure a copy of it with the same colors as
everyone else's copy to compare to her printout of the image taken by
this or that camera. I assume that the covers are probably printed in
one run on the same presses so every copy's color values should be more
or less identical.

Mike Eisenstadt
Austin, Texas
Austin, Texas

The problem is that most cameras are way more accurate then most
printers.

And I'll add that some recent printers, which try to "help" us with features
such as "photo enhance" only make matters worse. I am specifically
referring to an Epson R300, by the way. A good printer, for the price, but
"photo enhance" sucks.

I don't think correctly set up printers in good working order are all
that different. Even if they are, significantly, the downloader will be
keeping her printer. So she need only choose the camera model which has
the best color fidelity to the original (the magazine issue which she
has acquired to compare to) when printed on her printer.

Your remark about the auto-white balance control on the Canon 20D
suggests that you are expecting the camera to correct to any color
temperature of light you happen to be standing it. It would be
remarkable if it could do it right. I was proposing that the picture is
taken in color-corrected light provided by the photographer either with
5500 degrees Kelvin, with a strobe, or 3200 degrees Kelvin, with a
color-corrected quartz halide. Or, failing which, one can take the
picture in direct sunlight in mid-day.

Consistent print output is not pertinent to my proposal although it is
a real issue in its own right. I am merely interested in which model of
digital camera reproduces colors with the most fidelity. When compared
to the original. The colored side of American paper money is perhaps
too monochromatic. A 20 Euro bill which I have at hand is slightly more
colorful but not by much.

Mike Eisenstadt
Austin, Texas

Your remark makes no sense at all. How could you tell that the camera
is more accurate?
How do you propose to view the image?

Mike Eisenstadt
Austin, Texas

How do you know which magazines are printed where? Most I believe are
printed somewhere in the mid-west to reduce postage costs? Even if they
are printed locally, which I very much doubt, they are presumably
printed on the same presses with the same ink and with a techie present
to maintain consistency.

As for novices, why do we have to depend on novices? Not everone owns a
Minolta color temperature meter but some do. All we need is one
competent photographer for each model of camera. Perhaps some competent
photographers own more than one SLR.

You write that there are online comparisons that include standard color
charts.

That might work if one owned the color chart and the site provided
files to be downloaded, printed and compared with the original. Do you
know of any?

Mike Eisenstadt
Austin, Texas