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Pentax K10D aand K100D cameras



 
 
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  #1  
Old December 31st 07, 11:36 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
Richard Wrigley
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Posts: 1
Default Pentax K10D aand K100D cameras

Greetings from Norfolk (UK)

I am considering whether to buy either a K100D or a K10D Pentax, and am
interested in what current users of the two models have to say.
I am obviously aware of the price difference, the different no. of pixels
and the different type of battery used, but what features make the K10D
worth the extra.
Also, if I buy the K100D how many shots am I likely to get from a set of
batteries (assuming that flash is not used) ???
Any information would be much appreciated.
--
Richard.

"I have yet to see any problem, however complicated, which when looked at in
the right way, did not become still more complicated"
Poul Anderson



  #2  
Old December 31st 07, 02:23 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Steve B[_3_]
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Posts: 65
Default Pentax K10D aand K100D cameras


"Richard Wrigley" wrote in message
...
Greetings from Norfolk (UK)

I am considering whether to buy either a K100D or a K10D Pentax, and am
interested in what current users of the two models have to say.
I am obviously aware of the price difference, the different no. of pixels
and the different type of battery used, but what features make the K10D
worth the extra.
Also, if I buy the K100D how many shots am I likely to get from a set of
batteries (assuming that flash is not used) ???
Any information would be much appreciated.
--
Richard.

"I have yet to see any problem, however complicated, which when looked at
in
the right way, did not become still more complicated"
Poul Anderson




As a 15 month owner of a K100D I can answer some of your questions. I've
read quite a bit about the K10D as well and seen many images.

First off, don't buy the K10D or any of the other 10MP cameras for reasons
of image quality alone as the K100D is the match of them despite being 6MP.
Up-res a K100D picture to 10MP and there's a miniscule difference,
absolutely tiny, and I would go so far as to say that using RAW and Silkypix
3 as a converter it produces the most natural colours out of any of the 10MP
and below cameras. JPGs are fine but I find that the main problem is that
there is a fine line between perfect images and blowing out things like the
sky, and to get great results you will have the learn how to get spot-on
exposures, but the highlight flasher and digital preview helps a lot with
this. RAW just gives more leeway and I find it easier to work with. JPGs
also put more reliance on the white balance being correct at the time of
shooting, the K100D is fine I find in daylight conditions outdoors and
indoors, but in artificial light just be prepared to perform a manual WB
ritual first (quite easy), I don't find any of the presets much use with the
wide variety of lighting available these days.

To be worth going to the dearer cameras you have to be lusting after speed,
as that's all the K100D is lacking really. The small buffer means it's not
a camera for rapid fire bursts. Autofocus is fine and fast with the right
lens in good to dull light but below a certain level (pretty dim) it slows
down more than most DSLRs. A flashgun with an AF assist light brings the
speed back up indoors though (even if flash isn't used), I use a Sigma EF500
DG Super which can shine its assist light without firing the flash in its
ISO mode. There's no wireless flash, although I can use the built-in flash
to trigger my Sigma in manual mode set to a fixed power, so some fun with
remote flash can be had on the cheap.

I get about 600 shots from a charged set of Uniross Hybrios over any period
of time they're ever likely to stay in the camera (months). These and the
Sanyo Eneloops are the K100D batteries of choice for rechargeables. For
non-rechargeables, lithiums like Energizer e2's are the way to go (about
1500 shots). Ordinary NiMh rechargeables are OK if they're good ones and
used up within say a week where good ones will get about 800 shots, but
the low self discharge ones mentioned are much better in the K100D for
general use. Don't use alkalines apart from emergencies (about 100 shots if
you're lucky) or rechargeable lithiums unless you're absolutely sure they
are regulated to 3v per double-pack (I forget the proper name) and aren't
3.7v each. The K100D is a joy to use with old cheap manual lenses, the
camera gives an AF confirmation when manually focusing, and stop-down
metering is easy and works well (one extra button push required).

The K10D is a fine camera, it produces the best RAW out of all the 10MP
cameras mainly in highlight detail. If you want sharp JPGs you will have to
change the default settings, a quick comparison with the competition may
show JPGs as having soft edges but there's better texture detail especially
at higher ISOs and it tends to look very good in print being this way. Edge
detail can be enhanced by using Bright mode and reducing saturation. It's
faster than the K100D and matches the competition for speed again until the
light is very low where it slows down more than Canon and Nikon, don't know
about Olympus. If you bought a K10D it would be for the extra speed, the
unique exposure modes it has, and wireless flash capability using the built
in flash. It can use the newer lenses like the 16-50 and 50-130's quiet
ultra sonic AF motors which the K100D can't (the K100D Super can).

I've run out of time now, hope this helps.


  #3  
Old January 1st 08, 07:29 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
Andrew MacPherson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 140
Default Pentax K10D aand K100D cameras

(Richard Wrigley) wrote:

I am considering whether to buy either a K100D or a K10D Pentax


Steve B's fairly comprehensive reply sounds pretty well balanced to me.
The K10's a nice camera (especially at current prices!), but it's a
bigger lump to cart around, and that probably takes some getting used to.
However I'm considering one to update my 100D purely because my main use
for the DSLR (instead of my much more convenient and very capable
superzoom in most circumstances) is at airshows, and I spend a lot of
time cropping shots. So more pixels will definitely help me.

So, sadly, would faster focus speed. I'm planning a new camera + Sigma
50-500 before June, and at the moment I'll probably be tempted towards
Canon for the slightly faster, focus. In general use that's probably not
important (unless you have fast-moving children to aim at), but I found
my 100D's performance disappointing when aiming at fast moving objects in
the sky... no matter how well lit they are.

Andrew McP

PS One thing I will say is that having had a pretty capable superzoom,
and a DSLR for nearly a year, I think it's incredible what manufacturers
are able to produce from cameras with tiny sensors. The only time I reach
for my DSLR normally is when I know speed or low light or focus speed is
going to be the issue. The 100D may not always focus quickly enough for
my needs, but it's still a DSLR!

PPS I think any discussion of recent Pentax DSLRs has to mention noise.
When surrounded by Canons & Nikons at airshows last year I was surprised
at how much noisier my 100D was. It's not a subtle camera! This shouldn't
be important (especially at airshows :-), but if -- like me -- you
usually like to blend into the background when taking pictures, it's not
ideal. The K10 is quieter (sample sounds are available in the dpreview
reviews somewhere) but Pentax still need to work on this IMO.
  #4  
Old January 1st 08, 07:56 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
Rich
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 718
Default Pentax K10D aand K100D cameras

On Dec 31 2007, 5:36 am, "Richard Wrigley"
wrote:
Greetings from Norfolk (UK)

I am considering whether to buy either a K100D or a K10D Pentax, and am
interested in what current users of the two models have to say.
I am obviously aware of the price difference, the different no. of pixels
and the different type of battery used, but what features make the K10D
worth the extra.
Also, if I buy the K100D how many shots am I likely to get from a set of
batteries (assuming that flash is not used) ???
Any information would be much appreciated.
--
Richard.

"I have yet to see any problem, however complicated, which when looked at in
the right way, did not become still more complicated"
Poul Anderson


The K10D is a good camera, pretty complex, a big control set and is
able to produce good images if you put some work into them. But also
consider Olympus's E-510 for "out of the box" quality, both images and
kit lenses. Plus, it's a lot lighter, the K10D verges on the weigh of
some of the semi-pro models like Nikon's D200.
  #5  
Old January 5th 08, 07:47 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
John Turco
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,436
Default Pentax K10D aand K100D cameras

Steve B wrote:

"Richard Wrigley" wrote in message
...
Greetings from Norfolk (UK)

I am considering whether to buy either a K100D or a K10D Pentax, and am
interested in what current users of the two models have to say.
I am obviously aware of the price difference, the different no. of pixels
and the different type of battery used, but what features make the K10D
worth the extra.
Also, if I buy the K100D how many shots am I likely to get from a set of
batteries (assuming that flash is not used) ???
Any information would be much appreciated.



As a 15 month owner of a K100D I can answer some of your questions. I've
read quite a bit about the K10D as well and seen many images.


Hello, Steve:

I've had my K100D, since September of 2007. Got a damned good deal (on
the body only), from BuyDig.com http://www.buydig.com: $379 USD, with
free shipping.

A Pentax $50 rebate check - which took slightly more than a month to
arrive, incidentally - lowered the final price to $329.

Sweet!

First off, don't buy the K10D or any of the other 10MP cameras for reasons
of image quality alone as the K100D is the match of them despite being 6MP.
Up-res a K100D picture to 10MP and there's a miniscule difference,
absolutely tiny, and I would go so far as to say that using RAW and Silkypix
3 as a converter it produces the most natural colours out of any of the 10MP
and below cameras.


All very true.

JPGs are fine but I find that the main problem is that there is a fine line
between perfect images and blowing out things like the sky, and to get
great results you will have the learn how to get spot-on exposures, but the
highlight flasher and digital preview helps a lot with this. RAW just gives
more leeway and I find it easier to work with. JPGs also put more reliance
on the white balance being correct at the time of shooting, the K100D is fine
I find in daylight conditions outdoors and indoors, but in artificial light
just be prepared to perform a manual WB ritual first (quite easy), I don't
find any of the presets much use with the wide variety of lighting available
these days.


I generally concur with these statements, above. Except, I've not shot
any RAW images, yet, because the K100D's bundled, Silkypix-based
software applications (i.e., Pentax PHOTO Browser 3 and Pentax PHOTO
Laboratory 3) run much too slow, on my ancient Pentium III 1GHz/1GB RAM
computer.

Minimum requirements are Pentium 4 and 512MB (with 2GHz and 1GB,
recommended.)

To be worth going to the dearer cameras you have to be lusting after speed,
as that's all the K100D is lacking really. The small buffer means it's not
a camera for rapid fire bursts. Autofocus is fine and fast with the right
lens in good to dull light but below a certain level (pretty dim) it slows
down more than most DSLRs. A flashgun with an AF assist light brings the
speed back up indoors though (even if flash isn't used), I use a Sigma EF500
DG Super which can shine its assist light without firing the flash in its
ISO mode. There's no wireless flash, although I can use the built-in flash
to trigger my Sigma in manual mode set to a fixed power, so some fun with
remote flash can be had on the cheap.


Still haven't tried burst mode, nor do I own a compatible external flash
unit.

I get about 600 shots from a charged set of Uniross Hybrios over any period
of time they're ever likely to stay in the camera (months). These and the
Sanyo Eneloops are the K100D batteries of choice for rechargeables. For
non-rechargeables, lithiums like Energizer e2's are the way to go (about
1500 shots). Ordinary NiMh rechargeables are OK if they're good ones and
used up within say a week where good ones will get about 800 shots, but
the low self discharge ones mentioned are much better in the K100D for
general use. Don't use alkalines apart from emergencies (about 100 shots if
you're lucky) or rechargeable lithiums unless you're absolutely sure they
are regulated to 3v per double-pack (I forget the proper name) and aren't
3.7v each. The K100D is a joy to use with old cheap manual lenses, the
camera gives an AF confirmation when manually focusing, and stop-down
metering is easy and works well (one extra button push required).


I've used Kodak Ni-Mh cells (2500 mAh) in my camera, and experienced
adequate battery life.

The lens is a FAJ 28mmF3.5-80mmF5.6 autofocus type, borrowed from my
Pentax ZX-60 kit (35mm SLR); it's assembled in Vietnam and seems to be
a decent performer.

Of course, being a "film lens," it's somewhat bigger and heavier than
its "digital" counterpart. Also, due to the K100D's 1.5x "crop factor,"
my particular FAJ is the 35mm equivalent of 42mm-120mm -- hence, I
lose at wide-angle, but gain at the telephoto end (my preferences,
actually.) Plus, as one would expect, there's no vignetting to speak
of.

The ZX-60 kit was a mere $74.89 (on clearance), at a local Shopko
outlet, back in March, 2006. It even included an excellent carrying
case, which happens to fit my K100D/lens combo, nicely.

Thus, altogether, the complete DSLR outfit cost me a paltry $404,
approximately.

The K10D is a fine camera, it produces the best RAW out of all the 10MP
cameras mainly in highlight detail. If you want sharp JPGs you will have to
change the default settings, a quick comparison with the competition may
show JPGs as having soft edges but there's better texture detail especially
at higher ISOs and it tends to look very good in print being this way. Edge
detail can be enhanced by using Bright mode and reducing saturation. It's
faster than the K100D and matches the competition for speed again until the
light is very low where it slows down more than Canon and Nikon, don't know
about Olympus. If you bought a K10D it would be for the extra speed, the
unique exposure modes it has, and wireless flash capability using the built
in flash. It can use the newer lenses like the 16-50 and 50-130's quiet
ultra sonic AF motors which the K100D can't (the K100D Super can).


I'd simply like to add that, the K100D is far superior to the
entry-level models from Canon and Nikon, in build quality. After
handling those other brands, in stores, I came to appreciate Pentax's
apparent dedication to producing rugged and hefty DSLR's.

I've run out of time now, hope this helps.


Thanks, and same here!


Cordially,
John Turco
  #6  
Old January 5th 08, 07:47 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
John Turco
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,436
Default Pentax K10D aand K100D cameras

Andrew MacPherson wrote:

heavily edited for brevity

PPS I think any discussion of recent Pentax DSLRs has to mention noise.
When surrounded by Canons & Nikons at airshows last year I was surprised
at how much noisier my 100D was. It's not a subtle camera! This shouldn't
be important (especially at airshows :-), but if -- like me -- you
usually like to blend into the background when taking pictures, it's not
ideal. The K10 is quieter (sample sounds are available in the dpreview
reviews somewhere) but Pentax still need to work on this IMO.



Hello, Andrew:

I haven't noticed any noise issues, with my K100D, and I've shot
exclusively in JPEG.


Cordially,
John Turco
  #7  
Old January 5th 08, 07:47 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
John Turco
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,436
Default Pentax K10D aand K100D cameras

Rich wrote:

edited for brevity

The K10D is a good camera, pretty complex, a big control set and is
able to produce good images if you put some work into them. But also
consider Olympus's E-510 for "out of the box" quality, both images and
kit lenses. Plus, it's a lot lighter, the K10D verges on the weigh of
some of the semi-pro models like Nikon's D200.



Hello, Rich:

My K100D is built like a tank, so, why shouldn't it be rather heavier
than corresponding cameras from Nikon? As for Canon, its entry level
DSLR's seem positively frilly!


Cordially,
John Turco
 




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