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  #21  
Old January 7th 21, 09:40 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Bill W
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Posts: 1,692
Default Two images

On Jan 7, 2021, Melanie van Buren wrote
(in article ):

On 07/01/2021 17:44, Bill W wrote:
On Jan 7, 2021, Melanie van Buren wrote
(in article ):

The first image is by someone who knows what they are doing by taking an
idea and using a half decent camera and light i.e. Helmut Newton.

https://www.interviewmagazine.com/wp...HN-Walter-Stei
ger
-shoe-Monte-Carlo-1983-HR-scaled.jpg

The second picture is by someone with half a lazy clue who was in a
hurry (cropped and levelled shot using a camera swinging at the end of a
tripod) and didn't take much bother at all i.e. me. As not very good as
it is and certainly bad in comparison I found it to be a useful
exercise. If you take something good you may not always learn. By
comparing the good with the bad photo I can better understand the
differences at an emotional level. The lessons just sink in deeper and
motivate to do better next time.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/s4ee1apg9t...18-25-42-3.jpg


When you ask for comments, you are likely to get them. An artistic focus is
desirable, but the technical side counts, too. It’s out of focus AND
noisy,
which you probably did not intend. And the floor/wall joint is very
distracting, and appears to be more in focus than the subject. And imitation
has its uses, but limits, too.
Anyway, find your real camera, or replace it, and try some of your own
ideas.
You going to bore yourself right out of photography copying things.


As i said I was in a hurry and being lazy. I know what the faults are.
There's no need to overthink this or try to turn me into a gearhead or
tell me what pictures I should or shouldn't take.


No one is trying to do that.

Maybe just maybe I know more about neuro-psychology than you


Likely enough.

and have
other things going on in the background than I'm telling anyone.


That’s becoming more apparent by the minute.

I'm
learning MY way because this is what works for me and I am finding
myself motivated by what interests ME.

I bet I also sold more pictures to paying clients this week than all of
you put together.


You see, this is the part that doesn’t fit with everything else. You claim
to derive income from photography, yet you are here talking about the most
basic aspects of photography, and you don’t even know where your real
camera is, and even if you did, it has problems. What is your website?
Nothing comes up on a Google search.

It's a **** picture for sure and I can and hopefully
will do better as I get into a photography habit ands like 3000% better
than most of the competition I'm up against.


Again, you are selling photos, but you’re not actually into photography
right now. Or are you deliberately using “pictures” instead of
“photos”?

It's also one more photo than most of you posted this week.


Here you go, here’s a few thousand:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/48982192@N05/albums

Let me know if you detect any art. I personally think it’s a bunch of
snapshots.


  #22  
Old January 7th 21, 09:42 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Savageduck[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 16,487
Default Two images

On Jan 7, 2021, Bill W wrote
(in ternal-september.org):

On Jan 7, 2021, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Jan 7, 2021, Melanie van Buren wrote
(in article ):

On 07/01/2021 18:41, Savageduck wrote:

Some of us post images regularly, and some post when the whim urges us to
post. I for one make a reasonable contribution of images to this, and some
other groups, many times I get no response, sometimes I get a comment or
two.

Less lecturing and projecting. Where's your shoe picture? It's a simple
challenge and probably one of the easiest challenges I can think of.


OK! That’s fair enough. So since I did not have a pair mens size 13
stilettos available you are getting what I am wearing now.
I reached over and picked up my Fujifilm X-E3 which happened to have the Fuji
XF 16mm f/1.4 lens mounted, and shot my fashionably Sketchers shod foot. Just
ambient light, no flash or pro lighting.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/p8crjwms8fdy2eh/DSCF0945.jpg


Absolutely breathtaking. But no drone *foot*age?... Heh heh heh...


My latest drone “footage” was posted earlier on Tuesday the 5th, and it seems that it is yet to be noticed by anybody.

--
Regards,
Savageduck

  #23  
Old January 7th 21, 09:53 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Melanie van Buren
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 47
Default Two images

On 07/01/2021 19:37, Savageduck wrote:

I do not claim to be “so good”. I do claim to have over 60 years of experience in photography, but I am still learning, and I am prepared to share some of what I have learned.
As far as emulating Newton's, or your image my wardrobe does not include fishnet stockings, and stilettos. Besides my calves are not up for that sort of modeling.


I know more about the wardrobe issues and politics than having adeptness
with photography and just happy pootling by for now learning in my own
way and entertaining myself with my own internal dialogue.

Excuses, excuses. £20 all in off Ebay and you don't need to show
anything above the ankle. That said a decent quality shoe is noticeably
better and can determine what kind of picture is taken as the shoe,
background, and composition work together.

I usually wear crappy stockings as I always seem to wreck expensive ones
but I noticed this week the finish of some hold-ups was actually pretty
good. Apart from an adequate lace band there's a just perceptible gloss
to them. I'm not sure anyone would notice in a photo or what the best
light would be. Of course that may influence what kind of picture is
taken. A none **** camera might help too if I needed to be picky about
the light level. Bog standard pumps can work but shoes which make a
statement can be more interesting.

It's too cold at the moment but there's a few interesting places I can
take shoe pictures among others and the light will be a lot better.

--
Melanie van Buren
  #24  
Old January 7th 21, 10:07 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Melanie van Buren
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 47
Default Two images

On 07/01/2021 20:38, Alan Browne wrote:
On 2021-01-07 12:11, Melanie van Buren wrote:
The first image is by someone who knows what they are doing by taking
an idea and using a half decent camera and light i.e. Helmut Newton.

https://www.interviewmagazine.com/wp...-HR-scaled.jpg


The second picture is by someone with half a lazy clue who was in a
hurry (cropped and levelled shot using a camera swinging at the end of
a tripod) and didn't take much bother at all i.e. me. As not very good
as it is and certainly bad in comparison I found it to be a useful
exercise. If you take something good you may not always learn. By
comparing the good with the bad photo I can better understand the
differences at an emotional level. The lessons just sink in deeper and
motivate to do better next time.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/s4ee1apg9t...18-25-42-3.jpg



Composition is okay.* I find it too soft to be compelling.

Try a curved paper board to eliminate the line (floor/wall).
Something like:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/nik4385qut...urvPaperEx.jpg

(In the HM case probably outdoor in raw sunlight with a lot of room to
the front of the model)

You can shoot near a large window to get generous soft light (w/o direct
sunlight) that will still render a nice contrasty shadow.

Shoot a lot.* Try things.* But do try to make technically good shots as
well as nice compositions.* Try for more contrast too.

The emotional thing he the HM shot has a certain defiance to it.


Yes, it was a lazy shot. I have background materials on my todo list.
Available light is more than a bit crap at the moment and I have no
lights plus ****ty cameras. I'm not making a huge effort technically or
with light at the moment as the biggest challenge is actually getting
off my ass and doing something which includes setting the time aside for
it and wardrobe and location issues. It's been ages since I practiced
depth of field with my Canon G9. It's not brilliant and I'm not sure how
usable it is. I may be able to do something worthwile but have no ideas
at the moment. I count not dropping the camera as a win.

What with the practical issues I'm finding light a bit of a bummer at
the moment. As well as the technical more practice as you say to develop
a sense for this.

HN certainly liked his bright sunlight. I thought it was a carpet
originally but a closer look suggests concrete.


--
Melanie van Buren
  #25  
Old January 7th 21, 10:33 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Melanie van Buren
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 47
Default Two images

On 07/01/2021 20:40, Bill W wrote:
On Jan 7, 2021, Melanie van Buren wrote
(in article ):


I'm
learning MY way because this is what works for me and I am finding
myself motivated by what interests ME.

I bet I also sold more pictures to paying clients this week than all of
you put together.


You see, this is the part that doesn’t fit with everything else. You claim
to derive income from photography, yet you are here talking about the most
basic aspects of photography, and you don’t even know where your real
camera is, and even if you did, it has problems. What is your website?
Nothing comes up on a Google search.


Maybe if you read my two topics and the comments therein very carefully
the penny would drop. I'm also not on here to promote a website or any
other business. Again, as commented.

I'm just having a bit of fun at the moment and working myself up to take
photography more seriously, and no I'm not a gearhead, and yes I have my
principles and priorities, and this is an exercise for me and my self
satisfaction tangents and mistakes included not for anyone else. Most
people who buy my pictures probably couldn't give two ****s about the
artistic merit or even technical merit beyond the obvious and I'm not
hiring a photographer who will only impose their own artistic vision and
limits. I decided I wanted to do something better than I need to and the
exercise of doing it is useful plus it's a lot harder when you're the
model because there is a lot more work involved than a still life or
landscape.

I have plans for some photos and it requires a lot of setting up as well
as fixing the light before I press the shutter. Today I saw some
examples by my competition and at best they are snaps so don't give me a
hard time for deciding to take things seriously when you don't know what
the hurdles and expenses are to take anything good especially as I have
to work with what I have in terms of both equipment and locations
etcetera which has its own limits. Yes I can sweettalk people into
taking snaps and they may have some appeal but this comes with a lot of
other issues. They're either going to involve too much work, or be
inconvenient, or simply not practically possible.


--
Melanie van Buren
  #26  
Old January 7th 21, 11:29 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Bill W
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,692
Default Two images

On Jan 7, 2021, Melanie van Buren wrote
(in article ):

On 07/01/2021 20:40, Bill W wrote:
On Jan 7, 2021, Melanie van Buren wrote
(in article ):


I'm
learning MY way because this is what works for me and I am finding
myself motivated by what interests ME.

I bet I also sold more pictures to paying clients this week than all of
you put together.


You see, this is the part that doesn’t fit with everything else. You claim
to derive income from photography, yet you are here talking about the most
basic aspects of photography, and you don’t even know where your real
camera is, and even if you did, it has problems. What is your website?
Nothing comes up on a Google search.


Maybe if you read my two topics and the comments therein very carefully
the penny would drop. I'm also not on here to promote a website or any
other business. Again, as commented.


Yes, well I think I can guess what you’re talking about. The thing is,
bragging about selling what I think you’re talking about as if you’re
winning some competition on a photography discussion group does not make
sense. What you are selling would not be most readily described as
photography, but as something else a bit more clear. And posting these brags
on a usenet group populated entirely by men - folks who would be far more
likely to be purchasers of your work than sellers of the same thing.

It’s admirable that you want to learn, and everyone is very welcome to jump
in here - it has been slow, for one thing. But another thing I don’t get is
the anger. What’s that all about? You’re getting honest comments from
some very smart people with a lot of photography knowledge (and I’m trying,
too). So keep posting. And feel free to post some of those other
“pictures”...

I'm just having a bit of fun at the moment and working myself up to take
photography more seriously, and no I'm not a gearhead, and yes I have my
principles and priorities, and this is an exercise for me and my self
satisfaction tangents and mistakes included not for anyone else. Most
people who buy my pictures probably couldn't give two ****s about the
artistic merit or even technical merit beyond the obvious and I'm not
hiring a photographer who will only impose their own artistic vision and
limits. I decided I wanted to do something better than I need to and the
exercise of doing it is useful plus it's a lot harder when you're the
model because there is a lot more work involved than a still life or
landscape.

I have plans for some photos and it requires a lot of setting up as well
as fixing the light before I press the shutter. Today I saw some
examples by my competition and at best they are snaps so don't give me a
hard time for deciding to take things seriously when you don't know what
the hurdles and expenses are to take anything good especially as I have
to work with what I have in terms of both equipment and locations
etcetera which has its own limits. Yes I can sweettalk people into
taking snaps and they may have some appeal but this comes with a lot of
other issues. They're either going to involve too much work, or be
inconvenient, or simply not practically possible.



  #27  
Old January 8th 21, 12:13 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
Melanie van Buren
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 47
Default Two images

On 07/01/2021 22:29, Bill W wrote:
On Jan 7, 2021, Melanie van Buren wrote


Maybe if you read my two topics and the comments therein very carefully
the penny would drop. I'm also not on here to promote a website or any
other business. Again, as commented.


Yes, well I think I can guess what you’re talking about. The thing is,
bragging about selling what I think you’re talking about as if you’re
winning some competition on a photography discussion group does not make
sense. What you are selling would not be most readily described as
photography, but as something else a bit more clear. And posting these brags
on a usenet group populated entirely by men - folks who would be far more
likely to be purchasers of your work than sellers of the same thing.

It’s admirable that you want to learn, and everyone is very welcome to jump
in here - it has been slow, for one thing. But another thing I don’t get is
the anger. What’s that all about? You’re getting honest comments from
some very smart people with a lot of photography knowledge (and I’m trying,
too). So keep posting. And feel free to post some of those other
“pictures”...


First thought? Oh, do **** off. Second thought? I'm not angry. I just
don't have time for men who don't read what is written and who project
or bring too much baggage into the room. I'm positively nice compared to
some reactions.

No sorry. Photography is photography. Period. I don't publish anything
too overt. I prefer art or erotica or possibly something self-expressive
which might touch on the edges of feminist photography. Anything I learn
with this photography domain can translate to other photography domains.
Also how a photograph is interpreted is dependant on context and as much
in your mind as anything in the actual picture. For example I could take
the type of picture you would see in a brochure or lifestyle magazine to
pick two similar types with slightly different tilts and they would
still sell as the audience is looking for something else because of the
context. The context changes the interpretation. I like Helmut Newtons
pictures for the composition and light. There's plenty of his pictures I
admire technically and can appreciate as art I don't actually like and
wouldn't do myself for a lot of reasons. I like a lot of other pictures
too and just because I haven't talked about them or posted attempts
doesn't mean I don't know about them.

Maybe stop trying? I don't need people to "try". I'm not an idiot. I
also don't brag. I'm also perfectly capable of critiquing my own photos.
There isn't a single fault with the two pictures I have now posted I
didn't already know about. Yes, my pictures are cackhanded and lazy and
get basic technical things wrong. I KNOW THIS. It's also not the first
time in my life I started doing something new or taking it more
seriously. Like I said, it's not still life or a landscape. They are a
lot easier. This is different. It's like picking up a piece of clay for
the first time or a fancy recipe and put what you know into practice and
eff up then do it again.



--
Melanie van Buren
 




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