an excellent read from the ACLU

On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 17:02:09 +1100, "Trevor" wrote:
:
: "tony cooper" wrote in message
: news : Governments do the buying with taxpayers money, taxpayers rarely have any
: say in it.
:
: The government employees who do the buying are, themselves, taxpayers.
: In fact, they are sharing the burden more than many since they are
: employed - usually at rather good salaries
:
: That's the problem, it's not their money they waste, and they usually have
: a far better life style than many others.

The widespread belief that government employees in the U.S. are lavishly
compensated is largely myth. Police officers and teachers are usually paid
more than private sector employees of comparable education and experience,
because they're represented by extremely powerful labor unions. (In some
jurisdictions the same is true of fire fighters.) But the rest don't usually
fare as well as private-sector employees.

: and paying income taxes, property taxes, and taxes on purchases.
:
: Which is why they love flat taxes so much. The old days of progressive taxes
: where those who could afford it actually paid more, are just about gone
: unfortunately. The new paradigm is the richer you are, the better the
: accountant you can afford, shelf companies you can set up, family trusts you
: can utilise, off shore tax havens you can register, and the less tax you
: actually pay. The tax burdon now falls almost entirely on the middle class
: and poorest members of the community because they have no ability to escape
: it.
:
: Trevor.

And where on earth did you get the idea that public sector employees love flat
taxes? I've been a public sector employee for almost 17 years, and I can't
remember the last time I heard one, other than a candidate pandering to the
Tea Party, advocate a flat tax.

Bob

Robert Coe wrote:
On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 17:02:09 +1100, "Trevor" wrote:
:
: "tony cooper" wrote in message
: news : Governments do the buying with taxpayers money, taxpayers rarely have any
: say in it.
:
: The government employees who do the buying are, themselves, taxpayers.
: In fact, they are sharing the burden more than many since they are
: employed - usually at rather good salaries
:
: That's the problem, it's not their money they waste, and they usually have
: a far better life style than many others.

The widespread belief that government employees in the U.S. are lavishly
compensated is largely myth. Police officers and teachers are usually paid
more than private sector employees of comparable education and experience,

No they're not. Teachers are paid little compared to the many years
of training required and the hours that they put in. Police and fire
are paid a lot because they work at dangerous jobs.

because they're represented by extremely powerful labor unions.

You really are a sucker for right-wing propaganda, aren't you?
--
Ray Fischer | None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.
| Goethe

On 19 Dec 2011 19:00:02 GMT, (Ray Fischer) wrote:
: Robert Coe wrote:
: On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 17:02:09 +1100, "Trevor" wrote:
: :
: : "tony cooper" wrote in message
: : news : : Governments do the buying with taxpayers money, taxpayers rarely have
: : any say in it.
: :
: : The government employees who do the buying are, themselves, taxpayers.
: : In fact, they are sharing the burden more than many since they are
: : employed - usually at rather good salaries
: :
: : That's the problem, it's not their money they waste, and they usually
: : have a far better life style than many others.
:
: The widespread belief that government employees in the U.S. are lavishly
: compensated is largely myth. Police officers and teachers are usually paid
: more than private sector employees of comparable education and experience,
:
: No they're not. Teachers are paid little compared to the many years
: of training required and the hours that they put in. Police and fire
: are paid a lot because they work at dangerous jobs.
:
: because they're represented by extremely powerful labor unions.
:
: You really are a sucker for right-wing propaganda, aren't you?

Did you actually say that? I hope it's just your idea of a bad joke. If it
isn't, then you must not have read, or at least not have understood, anything
else I've ever said, even in this very thread.

Or have I simply failed to appreciate an outpouring of your sarcastic wit? If
so, then I guess you'll just have to excuse my obtuseness.

Bob

On 12/19/11 4:15 PM, in article ,
"Robert Coe" wrote:

On 19 Dec 2011 19:00:02 GMT, (Ray Fischer) wrote:
: Robert Coe wrote:
: On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 17:02:09 +1100, "Trevor" wrote:
: :
: : "tony cooper" wrote in message
: : news : : Governments do the buying with taxpayers money, taxpayers rarely have
: : any say in it.
: :
: : The government employees who do the buying are, themselves, taxpayers.
: : In fact, they are sharing the burden more than many since they are
: : employed - usually at rather good salaries
: :
: : That's the problem, it's not their money they waste, and they usually
: : have a far better life style than many others.
:
: The widespread belief that government employees in the U.S. are lavishly
: compensated is largely myth. Police officers and teachers are usually paid
: more than private sector employees of comparable education and experience,
:
: No they're not. Teachers are paid little compared to the many years
: of training required and the hours that they put in. Police and fire
: are paid a lot because they work at dangerous jobs.
:
: because they're represented by extremely powerful labor unions.
:
: You really are a sucker for right-wing propaganda, aren't you?

Did you actually say that? I hope it's just your idea of a bad joke. If it
isn't, then you must not have read, or at least not have understood, anything
else I've ever said, even in this very thread.

Or have I simply failed to appreciate an outpouring of your sarcastic wit? If
so, then I guess you'll just have to excuse my obtuseness.

Bob

LeftTards wouldn't know "wit" if it walked up and kicked them in the ass.

No, FishHead Rot is a typical Leftist who wants the grocery store to lower
the prices because he simply cannot control his spending, and for the banks
to give him his mortgage, because they are BAAAAAAAD.

He is a "99%'er of NO-Cal" - watch for him at the next "Occupy" event: He'll
be the one with the bong, begging for free hashish.

"Robert Coe" wrote in message
...
And where on earth did you get the idea that public sector employees love
flat
taxes? I've been a public sector employee for almost 17 years, and I can't
remember the last time I heard one, other than a candidate pandering to
the
Tea Party, advocate a flat tax.

I said the highly paid public sector employees, ie. the fat cats making the
taxation recommendations to politicians.
Are YOU one of those?
Obviously the lowly public sector employees have no say in the matter.

Trevor.

On Tue, 20 Dec 2011 11:33:27 +1100, "Trevor" wrote:
:
: "Robert Coe" wrote in message
: ...
: And where on earth did you get the idea that public sector employees
: love flat taxes? I've been a public sector employee for almost 17 years,
: and I can't remember the last time I heard one, other than a candidate
: pandering to the Tea Party, advocate a flat tax.
:
: I said the highly paid public sector employees, ie. the fat cats making
: the taxation recommendations to politicians.
: Are YOU one of those?
: Obviously the lowly public sector employees have no say in the matter.

Here's the quote, from Tony Cooper, to which you responded:

"The government employees who do the buying are, themselves, taxpayers.
In fact, they are sharing the burden more than many since they are
employed - usually at rather good salaries - and paying income taxes,
property taxes, and taxes on purchases."

The government employees who do the buying are purchasing agents, financial
analysts, etc. They are not the "fat cats" (almost none of whom are government
employees) of which you speak. And very few of them are advocates of a flat
tax.

Me? I work for a City government as a computer system manager and
photographer. Is that lowly enough to let me off the hook?

Bob

Robert Coe wrote:
On 19 Dec 2011 19:00:02 GMT, (Ray Fischer) wrote:
: Robert Coe wrote:
: On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 17:02:09 +1100, "Trevor" wrote:
: :
: : "tony cooper" wrote in message
: : news : : Governments do the buying with taxpayers money, taxpayers rarely have
: : any say in it.
: :
: : The government employees who do the buying are, themselves, taxpayers.
: : In fact, they are sharing the burden more than many since they are
: : employed - usually at rather good salaries
: :
: : That's the problem, it's not their money they waste, and they usually
: : have a far better life style than many others.
:
: The widespread belief that government employees in the U.S. are lavishly
: compensated is largely myth. Police officers and teachers are usually paid
: more than private sector employees of comparable education and experience,
:
: No they're not. Teachers are paid little compared to the many years
: of training required and the hours that they put in. Police and fire
: are paid a lot because they work at dangerous jobs.
:
: because they're represented by extremely powerful labor unions.
:
: You really are a sucker for right-wing propaganda, aren't you?

Did you actually say that? I hope it's just your idea of a bad joke.

Anybody who whines about the power of unions while ignoriong the power
of corporations and government cannot be very smart. The right to
choose who you work for and under what terms is fundamental to a free
society.

--
Ray Fischer | None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.
| Goethe

George Kerby wrote:



On 12/19/11 4:15 PM, in article ,
"Robert Coe" wrote:

On 19 Dec 2011 19:00:02 GMT, (Ray Fischer) wrote:
: Robert Coe wrote:
: On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 17:02:09 +1100, "Trevor" wrote:
: :
: : "tony cooper" wrote in message
: : news : : Governments do the buying with taxpayers money, taxpayers rarely have
: : any say in it.
: :
: : The government employees who do the buying are, themselves, taxpayers.
: : In fact, they are sharing the burden more than many since they are
: : employed - usually at rather good salaries
: :
: : That's the problem, it's not their money they waste, and they usually
: : have a far better life style than many others.
:
: The widespread belief that government employees in the U.S. are lavishly
: compensated is largely myth. Police officers and teachers are usually paid
: more than private sector employees of comparable education and experience,
:
: No they're not. Teachers are paid little compared to the many years
: of training required and the hours that they put in. Police and fire
: are paid a lot because they work at dangerous jobs.
:
: because they're represented by extremely powerful labor unions.
:
: You really are a sucker for right-wing propaganda, aren't you?

Did you actually say that? I hope it's just your idea of a bad joke. If it
isn't, then you must not have read, or at least not have understood, anything
else I've ever said, even in this very thread.

Or have I simply failed to appreciate an outpouring of your sarcastic wit? If
so, then I guess you'll just have to excuse my obtuseness.

Bob

LeftTards wouldn't know "wit" if it walked up and kicked them in the ass.

Like a little ****ty chihuahua dog that no one pays any attention, you just
bark on, begging for attention
kerby explains his childishness

--
Ray Fischer | None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.
| Goethe

"Robert Coe" wrote in message
...
: And where on earth did you get the idea that public sector employees
: love flat taxes? I've been a public sector employee for almost 17
years,
: and I can't remember the last time I heard one, other than a candidate
: pandering to the Tea Party, advocate a flat tax.
:
: I said the highly paid public sector employees, ie. the fat cats making
: the taxation recommendations to politicians.
: Are YOU one of those?
: Obviously the lowly public sector employees have no say in the matter.

Here's the quote, from Tony Cooper, to which you responded:

"The government employees who do the buying are, themselves, taxpayers.
In fact, they are sharing the burden more than many since they are
employed - usually at rather good salaries - and paying income taxes,
property taxes, and taxes on purchases."

That was already in response to what I wrote, and just like you tried to
make a straw man out of misrepresnting it.



The government employees who do the buying are purchasing agents,
financial
analysts, etc. They are not the "fat cats" (almost none of whom are
government
employees) of which you speak. And very few of them are advocates of a
flat
tax.

As I said, many of the taxation policy advisors are.


Me? I work for a City government as a computer system manager and
photographer. Is that lowly enough to let me off the hook?

I never put you on it. What influence do YOU feel you have over taxation
policy that you *would* be included?

Trevor.

"John A." wrote in message
...
As I said, many of the taxation policy advisors are.

Lobbyists? Oh yeah. They're not government employees, though.
(Government employee employers, maybe.)

NOT party lobbyists, government paid advisors, chief bureaucrats and
department heads.

Trevor.