Update on printing color on the Epson SureColor P800

I am starting a completely new thread to get away from the confusion
of the 'Wide gamut' monitor thread.

The point I wanted to investigate was the which appeared in discussion
with Floyd: whether an all sRGB work flow is the way to go if your
screen and printer will let you go wider. So I have carried out two
tests.

First I used the well known test image from Steinmuller and Jurgens
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...2_ProPhoto.tif

I printed this four times from PhotoshopCC in different places on an
A2 sheet of Epson Premium Glossy paper. The settings were as follows:

1. AdobeRGB workspace, printer manages colors, AdobeRGB on printer
2. Prophoto workspace, printer manages colors, AdobeRGB on printer
3. Prophoto workspace, printer manages colours, sRGB on printer
4. Prophoto workspace, printer manages colours, ICM on printer.

The ICM image was - yuk! It would only be good for printing images of
cow dung. :-(

Irrespective of the workspace, both the images printed with an
AdobeRGB color space on the printer were drab compared with the image
printed with sRGB on the printer.

At this point it occurred to me that the original test image may have
been made for an sRGB color space so I decided to make my own. I took
three of my own raw images and processed them in Photoshop using a
ProPhoto workspace. A JPG of this can be found at
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...0Composite.jpg
I have used the image at the top right as a test print before and I
used the other two mainly because I was most interested in reds and
greens.

I ran four prints again on A2 Epson Premium Glossy paper. All images
were processed in ProPhoto workspace. The four test prints we

1. Colors managed by Photoshop using the Epson profile for the paper.
2. Printer manages colors with the printer set to an AdobeRGB color
space.
3. Printer manages colors with the printer set to an sRGB color space.
4. Printer manages colors with the printer set to ICM specified color
space.

It was very hard to tell the difference between the image (1) managed
by Photoshop and image (3) using an sRGB color space. For some details
(1) was better but for other details (3) was better. I think (1) had
the edge but by two tenths of a gnat's whisker.

In comparison, the AdobeRGB color space set on the printer was as drab
as those in the first tape. The ICM setting was again - yuk.

On this basis, I would say Floyd was correct. If you are using Windows
10, Photoshop and Epson printers stick to an all sRGB work flow. This
shouldn't be the best way but it seems as though it is. It looks to me
as though Adobe have not yet embraced Microsoft's new XPS print
specification and we are still stuck with the old system confined to
an sRGB color space.


When I first bought my P800 I was disconcerted to find that it
contained profiles for about five papers and that my then favourite
was not included. After talking to a helpful Epson engineer in
Australia I found there were several distinct drivers out there in the
wild including for Japan, USA, Europe, Asia, Australia, and New
Zealand. These were all different with different combinations of paper
profiles. Eventually I got what I wanted and settled down with the
Australian driver.

A few days ago Driver Detective told me that my Epson driver was out
of date and requested permission (which I granted) to update the
driver. I find now that I have a huge number of different paper
profiles and that the user instructions have abandoned the advice to
let the printer do the management.

When I started using my new wide gamut screen with an AdobeRGB color
space I also switched to AdobeRGB for the printer. I got better
results on a key print (as I described) and attributed it to the wider
color space. Now, I very much doubt that conclusion. It is far more
likely that the changes are due to the printer driver. But I am yet to
be certain.

No doubt there is more to come.
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:


On this basis, I would say Floyd was correct.

he is not.

If you are using Windows
10, Photoshop and Epson printers stick to an all sRGB work flow. This
shouldn't be the best way but it seems as though it is. It looks to me
as though Adobe have not yet embraced Microsoft's new XPS print
specification and we are still stuck with the old system confined to
an sRGB color space.

as per the article you posted, that's a windows limitation, *not* an
adobe limitation nor a colour management limitation.

if you were using a mac or other windows software, no such limitation
applies, which means you could use something other than srgb and obtain
the best results.

also note that floyd doesn't use windows, so apparently this srgb issue
applies to his setup too.

When I first bought my P800 I was disconcerted to find that it
contained profiles for about five papers and that my then favourite
was not included. After talking to a helpful Epson engineer in
Australia I found there were several distinct drivers out there in the
wild including for Japan, USA, Europe, Asia, Australia, and New
Zealand. These were all different with different combinations of paper
profiles. Eventually I got what I wanted and settled down with the
Australian driver.

ideally, you should profile your printer/ink/paper combo rather than
use the canned profiles.

A few days ago Driver Detective told me that my Epson driver was out
of date and requested permission (which I granted) to update the
driver. I find now that I have a huge number of different paper
profiles and that the user instructions have abandoned the advice to
let the printer do the management.

it's still a choice.

When I started using my new wide gamut screen with an AdobeRGB color
space I also switched to AdobeRGB for the printer. I got better
results on a key print (as I described) and attributed it to the wider
color space. Now, I very much doubt that conclusion. It is far more
likely that the changes are due to the printer driver. But I am yet to
be certain.

you list several changes, so it could be due to several factors.

No doubt there is more to come.

ok

On Mon, 23 Jan 2017 23:19:55 -0500, nospam
wrote:

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:


On this basis, I would say Floyd was correct.

he is not.

If you are using Windows
10, Photoshop and Epson printers stick to an all sRGB work flow. This
shouldn't be the best way but it seems as though it is. It looks to me
as though Adobe have not yet embraced Microsoft's new XPS print
specification and we are still stuck with the old system confined to
an sRGB color space.

as per the article you posted, that's a windows limitation, *not* an
adobe limitation nor a colour management limitation.

If I have understood the article I cited a few days ago Windows XPS
overcomes the sRGB limitation. Is this not correct?

if you were using a mac or other windows software, no such limitation
applies, which means you could use something other than srgb and obtain
the best results.

also note that floyd doesn't use windows, so apparently this srgb issue
applies to his setup too.

Is he Linux fan?

When I first bought my P800 I was disconcerted to find that it
contained profiles for about five papers and that my then favourite
was not included. After talking to a helpful Epson engineer in
Australia I found there were several distinct drivers out there in the
wild including for Japan, USA, Europe, Asia, Australia, and New
Zealand. These were all different with different combinations of paper
profiles. Eventually I got what I wanted and settled down with the
Australian driver.

ideally, you should profile your printer/ink/paper combo rather than
use the canned profiles.

How much gear do I need (assuming I can't find a local service to do
this for me, which I can't)?

A few days ago Driver Detective told me that my Epson driver was out
of date and requested permission (which I granted) to update the
driver. I find now that I have a huge number of different paper
profiles and that the user instructions have abandoned the advice to
let the printer do the management.

it's still a choice.

When I started using my new wide gamut screen with an AdobeRGB color
space I also switched to AdobeRGB for the printer. I got better
results on a key print (as I described) and attributed it to the wider
color space. Now, I very much doubt that conclusion. It is far more
likely that the changes are due to the printer driver. But I am yet to
be certain.

you list several changes, so it could be due to several factors.

No doubt there is more to come.

ok
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:


If you are using Windows
10, Photoshop and Epson printers stick to an all sRGB work flow. This
shouldn't be the best way but it seems as though it is. It looks to me
as though Adobe have not yet embraced Microsoft's new XPS print
specification and we are still stuck with the old system confined to
an sRGB color space.

as per the article you posted, that's a windows limitation, *not* an
adobe limitation nor a colour management limitation.

If I have understood the article I cited a few days ago Windows XPS
overcomes the sRGB limitation. Is this not correct?

could be. i don't do windows at that level.

if you were using a mac or other windows software, no such limitation
applies, which means you could use something other than srgb and obtain
the best results.

also note that floyd doesn't use windows, so apparently this srgb issue
applies to his setup too.

Is he Linux fan?

that's an understatement. it's all he knows and considers anyone who
uses mac/win to be lesser forms of life.

When I first bought my P800 I was disconcerted to find that it
contained profiles for about five papers and that my then favourite
was not included. After talking to a helpful Epson engineer in
Australia I found there were several distinct drivers out there in the
wild including for Japan, USA, Europe, Asia, Australia, and New
Zealand. These were all different with different combinations of paper
profiles. Eventually I got what I wanted and settled down with the
Australian driver.

ideally, you should profile your printer/ink/paper combo rather than
use the canned profiles.

How much gear do I need (assuming I can't find a local service to do
this for me, which I can't)?

you need a puck that can scan prints. if you're only going to use a few
papers, it's cheaper to have it done (and they'll be using much better
equipment than you would have purchased). such a service need not be
local. print out the test sheets and mail them, and you get profiles
sent back.