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Real portability? Nikon and Pentax are working on it



 
 
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  #1  
Old May 9th 11, 07:52 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Bowser
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Posts: 309
Default Real portability? Nikon and Pentax are working on it

On 5/8/2011 8:28 PM, RichA wrote:
Rumours still that Nikon is working on an EVIL with a sensor with
about 1/2 the area of 4/3rds while Pentax is working on one with a
sensor the size of...a superzoom P&S!!!

Will it be like this?

http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/134548398


If Pentax does ape their failed 110 camera, it'll fail as well. What
would you rather carry, that stupid little interchangeable lens camera
or a good quality superzoom where you don't have to change lenses?

I'll keep my FZ35.
  #2  
Old May 9th 11, 09:51 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Rich[_6_]
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Posts: 1,081
Default Real portability? Nikon and Pentax are working on it

Bowser wrote in news:3J-
:

On 5/8/2011 8:28 PM, RichA wrote:
Rumours still that Nikon is working on an EVIL with a sensor with
about 1/2 the area of 4/3rds while Pentax is working on one with a
sensor the size of...a superzoom P&S!!!

Will it be like this?

http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/134548398


If Pentax does ape their failed 110 camera, it'll fail as well. What
would you rather carry, that stupid little interchangeable lens camera
or a good quality superzoom where you don't have to change lenses?

I'll keep my FZ35.


Well, you have a point. Any camera outfitted with such a sensor will be a
huge compromise. I think though the selling feature will be the ability to
mount a very small lens (the old Pentax 24mm lens is the size of an old SLR
hot shoe, almost) and carry the camera comfortably in your pocket, with
perhaps a longer lens or zoom in another pocket, if needed. You can't do
that with a lumpen Superzoom.
  #3  
Old May 9th 11, 10:50 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Eric Stevens
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Posts: 12,263
Default Real portability? Nikon and Pentax are working on it

On Mon, 09 May 2011 15:51:01 -0500, Rich wrote:

Bowser wrote in news:3J-
:

On 5/8/2011 8:28 PM, RichA wrote:
Rumours still that Nikon is working on an EVIL with a sensor with
about 1/2 the area of 4/3rds while Pentax is working on one with a
sensor the size of...a superzoom P&S!!!

Will it be like this?

http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/134548398


If Pentax does ape their failed 110 camera, it'll fail as well. What
would you rather carry, that stupid little interchangeable lens camera
or a good quality superzoom where you don't have to change lenses?

I'll keep my FZ35.


Well, you have a point. Any camera outfitted with such a sensor will be a
huge compromise. I think though the selling feature will be the ability to
mount a very small lens (the old Pentax 24mm lens is the size of an old SLR
hot shoe, almost) and carry the camera comfortably in your pocket, with
perhaps a longer lens or zoom in another pocket, if needed. You can't do
that with a lumpen Superzoom.


Canon G12?

Regards,

Eric Stevens
  #4  
Old May 10th 11, 12:34 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Bowser
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Posts: 309
Default Real portability? Nikon and Pentax are working on it

On 5/9/2011 4:51 PM, Rich wrote:
wrote in news:3J-
:

On 5/8/2011 8:28 PM, RichA wrote:
Rumours still that Nikon is working on an EVIL with a sensor with
about 1/2 the area of 4/3rds while Pentax is working on one with a
sensor the size of...a superzoom P&S!!!

Will it be like this?

http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/134548398


If Pentax does ape their failed 110 camera, it'll fail as well. What
would you rather carry, that stupid little interchangeable lens camera
or a good quality superzoom where you don't have to change lenses?

I'll keep my FZ35.


Well, you have a point. Any camera outfitted with such a sensor will be a
huge compromise. I think though the selling feature will be the ability to
mount a very small lens (the old Pentax 24mm lens is the size of an old SLR
hot shoe, almost) and carry the camera comfortably in your pocket, with
perhaps a longer lens or zoom in another pocket, if needed. You can't do
that with a lumpen Superzoom.


True enough, but will a camera that small be usable? Even for those of
us with average size hands, I can't see how it will be anything but
clumsy. Even the NEX 5 is cutting it close for being too small.

We'll see. No point debating the pros and cons of rumored cams. In the
meantime, I'll continue to enjoy the three cams I do have since I'm
pretty sure they're not rumors.
  #5  
Old May 10th 11, 12:35 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Bowser
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 309
Default Real portability? Nikon and Pentax are working on it

On 5/9/2011 6:06 PM, Bruce wrote:
wrote:
wrote in news:3J-
:

On 5/8/2011 8:28 PM, RichA wrote:
Rumours still that Nikon is working on an EVIL with a sensor with
about 1/2 the area of 4/3rds while Pentax is working on one with a
sensor the size of...a superzoom P&S!!!

Will it be like this?

http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/134548398


If Pentax does ape their failed 110 camera, it'll fail as well. What
would you rather carry, that stupid little interchangeable lens camera
or a good quality superzoom where you don't have to change lenses?

I'll keep my FZ35.


Well, you have a point. Any camera outfitted with such a sensor will be a
huge compromise. I think though the selling feature will be the ability to
mount a very small lens (the old Pentax 24mm lens is the size of an old SLR
hot shoe, almost) and carry the camera comfortably in your pocket, with
perhaps a longer lens or zoom in another pocket, if needed. You can't do
that with a lumpen Superzoom.



The FZ35/38 is a particularly compact camera, much smaller than some
other superzooms. But if you want a truly pocketable camera, there
are quite a few P&S digicams that have *both* excellent image quality
*and* a useful zoom range.

Staying with Panasonic, the LUMIX DMC-ZS10 (TZ20 in Europe) and ZS-8
(TZ18) offer a very slim, easily pocketable form factor and extremely
good image quality. A 14.1 MP sensor, an image processor with very
good control of noise, 1080i AVCHD video (720P MPEG on the cheaper
ZS-8) and a 16X zoom Leica-badged lens (24-384 mm equivalent) makes
for a very good package. All this for under $350 at B&H.

Of course these cameras won't suit the DSLR snobs, even though most of
those haven't a hope in hell of demonstrating any superiority over the
results these fine digicams can produce.



Hey! Does this make you a "superzoom snob?"

:-)
  #6  
Old May 10th 11, 12:36 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Bowser
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Posts: 309
Default Real portability? Nikon and Pentax are working on it

On 5/9/2011 5:14 PM, Bruce wrote:
wrote:
On 5/8/2011 8:28 PM, RichA wrote:
Rumours still that Nikon is working on an EVIL with a sensor with
about 1/2 the area of 4/3rds while Pentax is working on one with a
sensor the size of...a superzoom P&S!!!

Will it be like this?

http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/134548398


If Pentax does ape their failed 110 camera, it'll fail as well. What
would you rather carry, that stupid little interchangeable lens camera
or a good quality superzoom where you don't have to change lenses?



The Pentax 110 SLR was a niche produce way back when. I agree it
would be crazy to ape it in a CSC, although there is already a Pentax
P&S which looks very like it:
http://www.dpreview.com/news/1001/10...axoptioi10.asp


I'll keep my FZ35.



I'm very impressed with my partner's FZ38 (same model as the FZ35).

Very, very, very few people need any more camera than this. ;-)



I use mine all the time, unless the situation calls for the 5D II. But
Panasonic did a nice job on the FZ35. Best JPG engine on the market, and
an auto mode that really, really works well. Love it.
  #7  
Old May 10th 11, 01:39 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Bowser
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Posts: 309
Default Real portability? Nikon and Pentax are working on it

On 5/10/2011 7:04 AM, Bruce wrote:
wrote:

Hey! Does this make you a "superzoom snob?"
:-)



No, but there is nothing wrong with singing their praises.

People who obsess about pixel densities and unquestioningly assert
that only DSLRs will do are denying themselves the opportunity to use
these outstanding cameras.


Likewise, anyone who claims that ANY camera, superzoom or not, is good
for everything is also denying reality. I've yet to see a one size fits
all solution.
  #8  
Old May 10th 11, 04:09 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Bowser
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Posts: 309
Default Real portability? Nikon and Pentax are working on it

On 5/10/2011 9:36 AM, Bruce wrote:
wrote:
On 5/10/2011 7:04 AM, Bruce wrote:
wrote:

Hey! Does this make you a "superzoom snob?"
:-)


No, but there is nothing wrong with singing their praises.

People who obsess about pixel densities and unquestioningly assert
that only DSLRs will do are denying themselves the opportunity to use
these outstanding cameras.


Likewise, anyone who claims that ANY camera, superzoom or not, is good
for everything is also denying reality. I've yet to see a one size fits
all solution.



True, but a good superzoom comes very close, satisfying the needs of
more people than any other camera type. Quite a few people find
superzooms intimidating, and want something smaller and/or simpler,
and a P&S is ideal for them.

P&S and superzooms together cover the needs of the vast majority of
camera users. Very few people need a DSLR, but many more people buy
them than need them. Perhaps mirrorless CSCs offer a good compromise?


Not until the Af improves. For all the hype, the AF systems (at least
the models I've tried) still can't touch SLR AF. So if you need to shoot
moving subjects you are better served by an SLR. Likewise with low
lighting situations where the larger sensors offer a huge advantage.
Combine the two, and you get high school football at night, where you
have action plus crap lighting. Luckily, I'm done with that!

Anyway, the FZ35 will see a lot of action this summer, for sure. Besides
the nice lens, the small size makes it a perfect "bike bag" camera. I
can grab it from the pouch and shoot while riding so the group doesn't
have to stop while I screw around with a camera. Works well this way, too!
  #9  
Old May 11th 11, 05:21 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Wolfgang Weisselberg
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Posts: 5,319
Default Real portability? Nikon and Pentax are working on it

Bruce wrote:
Bowser wrote:


Likewise, anyone who claims that ANY camera, superzoom or not, is good
for everything is also denying reality. I've yet to see a one size fits
all solution.


True, but a good superzoom comes very close, satisfying the needs of
more people than any other camera type.


I doubt that. See how many people use their mobile phone camera
and are happy enough with it --- happy enough to use it and
not carry another camera with them for most of the time. So I
respectfully submit that the humble mobile phone camera satisfies
the need of more people than the superzoom.

Quite a few people find
superzooms intimidating, and want something smaller and/or simpler,
and a P&S is ideal for them.


The camera phone is always with you, small and usually really
simple. Even a P&S cannot beat that.

P&S and superzooms together cover the needs of the vast majority of
camera users.


Again I disagree. See above. Camera users happen to include
mobile phone camera users.

Very few people need a DSLR, but many more people buy
them than need them.


"Very few" people are professional photographers, who also
need the image quality under iffy conditions and MPix
DSLRs can offer. Amateurs by definition do not *need*
cameras, they can just find another hobby.

Perhaps mirrorless CSCs offer a good compromise?


That would depend on why people who don't "need" a DSLR buy a DSLR.

-Wolfgang
  #10  
Old May 11th 11, 05:38 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.digital
Wolfgang Weisselberg
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Posts: 5,319
Default Real portability? Nikon and Pentax are working on it

Bruce wrote:
Bowser wrote:


Not until the Af improves. For all the hype, the AF systems (at least
the models I've tried) still can't touch SLR AF. So if you need to shoot
moving subjects you are better served by an SLR.


That's changing, though not as rapidly as I thought.


It'd better be.

The Panasonic LUMIX DMC-GH2 has an ultra-fast contrast-detect AF
system that would shame most of today's DSLRs.


Dpreview, while impressed (for a CDAF), doesn't think the AF
"would shame most of today's DSLRs" ... I read there that
they'd prefer a DSLR for fast action.

I'd like to see tests in bad conditions (low light, low contrast,
both, etc.) with reliable numbers for from misfocussed to shot
time.

It is fast, decisive
and extremely accurate - the latter cannot be truthfully said of many
DSLRs' phase-detect systems, which tend to have systematic errors.


There are also systematic errors in sensor mountings, lens mounts
and lenses --- guess how many lenses are actually 100% parallel
to the sensor. Most PDAFs function very well, thank you.

-Wolfgang
 




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