Flaw in T. Phillips "Digital is not photography" argument

"jjs" wrote in message

"Odd freeware" and PDP/11 don't go together.

Surprisingly enough, I think they do. For college kids in
the late 60's early 70's this used to be their 'personal'
computer (as in being in the computer center from 2am to 6am)
- so you can imagine what got written for it. It soon
became the hobby system in the 70's. I had several friends
with 11's made from 'surplus' parts bought at hamfests
(Prof: Hey! What happened to my computer? Where'd the
front panel go?).

How much is the person willing to pay for a conversion,

You would need to find an 11 user with a copy of said WP program
and 8" drives. Such may not exist. The logical place for this
rig, an HT-11 UG did come up empty according to the OP. There
were way more PDP-11s than HT-11s, and if the disk drives and
software were the same as used on the HT-11, then there may be
success.

My guess the cost is zilch. Or if you go to someone who makes
a living at it, well who knows ...

If the data can be moved to PC format it may be possible to
pull the text out of the files with a binary editor.

Now, what sort of 8" floppy: Single sided; Double sided;
Hard sectored; Soft sectored; Number of sectors; Tracks per
inch ...?

--
Nicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio
Consulting Engineer: Electronics; Informatics; Photonics.
Remove spaces etc. to reply: n o lindan at net com dot com
psst.. want to buy an f-stop timer? nolindan.com/da/fstop/

"jjs" wrote in message

"Odd freeware" and PDP/11 don't go together.

Surprisingly enough, I think they do. For college kids in
the late 60's early 70's this used to be their 'personal'
computer (as in being in the computer center from 2am to 6am)
- so you can imagine what got written for it. It soon
became the hobby system in the 70's. I had several friends
with 11's made from 'surplus' parts bought at hamfests
(Prof: Hey! What happened to my computer? Where'd the
front panel go?).

How much is the person willing to pay for a conversion,

You would need to find an 11 user with a copy of said WP program
and 8" drives. Such may not exist. The logical place for this
rig, an HT-11 UG did come up empty according to the OP. There
were way more PDP-11s than HT-11s, and if the disk drives and
software were the same as used on the HT-11, then there may be
success.

My guess the cost is zilch. Or if you go to someone who makes
a living at it, well who knows ...

If the data can be moved to PC format it may be possible to
pull the text out of the files with a binary editor.

Now, what sort of 8" floppy: Single sided; Double sided;
Hard sectored; Soft sectored; Number of sectors; Tracks per
inch ...?

--
Nicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio
Consulting Engineer: Electronics; Informatics; Photonics.
Remove spaces etc. to reply: n o lindan at net com dot com
psst.. want to buy an f-stop timer? nolindan.com/da/fstop/

"jjs" wrote in message

"Odd freeware" and PDP/11 don't go together.

Surprisingly enough, I think they do. For college kids in
the late 60's early 70's this used to be their 'personal'
computer (as in being in the computer center from 2am to 6am)
- so you can imagine what got written for it. It soon
became the hobby system in the 70's. I had several friends
with 11's made from 'surplus' parts bought at hamfests
(Prof: Hey! What happened to my computer? Where'd the
front panel go?).

How much is the person willing to pay for a conversion,

You would need to find an 11 user with a copy of said WP program
and 8" drives. Such may not exist. The logical place for this
rig, an HT-11 UG did come up empty according to the OP. There
were way more PDP-11s than HT-11s, and if the disk drives and
software were the same as used on the HT-11, then there may be
success.

My guess the cost is zilch. Or if you go to someone who makes
a living at it, well who knows ...

If the data can be moved to PC format it may be possible to
pull the text out of the files with a binary editor.

Now, what sort of 8" floppy: Single sided; Double sided;
Hard sectored; Soft sectored; Number of sectors; Tracks per
inch ...?

--
Nicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio
Consulting Engineer: Electronics; Informatics; Photonics.
Remove spaces etc. to reply: n o lindan at net com dot com
psst.. want to buy an f-stop timer? nolindan.com/da/fstop/

"jjs" wrote in message

"Odd freeware" and PDP/11 don't go together.

Surprisingly enough, I think they do. For college kids in
the late 60's early 70's this used to be their 'personal'
computer (as in being in the computer center from 2am to 6am)
- so you can imagine what got written for it. It soon
became the hobby system in the 70's. I had several friends
with 11's made from 'surplus' parts bought at hamfests
(Prof: Hey! What happened to my computer? Where'd the
front panel go?).

How much is the person willing to pay for a conversion,

You would need to find an 11 user with a copy of said WP program
and 8" drives. Such may not exist. The logical place for this
rig, an HT-11 UG did come up empty according to the OP. There
were way more PDP-11s than HT-11s, and if the disk drives and
software were the same as used on the HT-11, then there may be
success.

My guess the cost is zilch. Or if you go to someone who makes
a living at it, well who knows ...

If the data can be moved to PC format it may be possible to
pull the text out of the files with a binary editor.

Now, what sort of 8" floppy: Single sided; Double sided;
Hard sectored; Soft sectored; Number of sectors; Tracks per
inch ...?

--
Nicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio
Consulting Engineer: Electronics; Informatics; Photonics.
Remove spaces etc. to reply: n o lindan at net com dot com
psst.. want to buy an f-stop timer? nolindan.com/da/fstop/

Nicholas O. Lindan wrote:
: "jjs" wrote in message

: "Odd freeware" and PDP/11 don't go together.

: Surprisingly enough, I think they do. For college kids in
: the late 60's early 70's this used to be their 'personal'
: computer (as in being in the computer center from 2am to 6am)
: - so you can imagine what got written for it. It soon
: became the hobby system in the 70's. I had several friends
: with 11's made from 'surplus' parts bought at hamfests
: (Prof: Hey! What happened to my computer? Where'd the
: front panel go?).

: How much is the person willing to pay for a conversion,

: You would need to find an 11 user with a copy of said WP program
: and 8" drives. Such may not exist. The logical place for this
: rig, an HT-11 UG did come up empty according to the OP. There
: were way more PDP-11s than HT-11s, and if the disk drives and
: software were the same as used on the HT-11, then there may be
: success.

: My guess the cost is zilch. Or if you go to someone who makes
: a living at it, well who knows ...

: If the data can be moved to PC format it may be possible to
: pull the text out of the files with a binary editor.

: Now, what sort of 8" floppy: Single sided; Double sided;
: Hard sectored; Soft sectored; Number of sectors; Tracks per
: inch ...?

I don't even want to think about having to deal with 8" floppies!! I had
some fun about 5 years ago when I retired an old Sun server because it wasn't
capable of running a y2k compliant OS. I shut it down and scrapped the server
but hung onto the SMD drives. Two monthes later I got a call from a user that
demanded that I reconnect the SMD drive to another server so she could recover
data from it.

As those of us in the IT field know and have been upfront about is media
obsolecenseSP? is an issue. Another problem is what to do with data that you
can read from the media but don't have the software to deal with the data. This
is of course a bigger issue then just what to do with digital images.
--




Keep working millions on welfare depend on you
-------------------

Nicholas O. Lindan wrote:
: "jjs" wrote in message

: "Odd freeware" and PDP/11 don't go together.

: Surprisingly enough, I think they do. For college kids in
: the late 60's early 70's this used to be their 'personal'
: computer (as in being in the computer center from 2am to 6am)
: - so you can imagine what got written for it. It soon
: became the hobby system in the 70's. I had several friends
: with 11's made from 'surplus' parts bought at hamfests
: (Prof: Hey! What happened to my computer? Where'd the
: front panel go?).

: How much is the person willing to pay for a conversion,

: You would need to find an 11 user with a copy of said WP program
: and 8" drives. Such may not exist. The logical place for this
: rig, an HT-11 UG did come up empty according to the OP. There
: were way more PDP-11s than HT-11s, and if the disk drives and
: software were the same as used on the HT-11, then there may be
: success.

: My guess the cost is zilch. Or if you go to someone who makes
: a living at it, well who knows ...

: If the data can be moved to PC format it may be possible to
: pull the text out of the files with a binary editor.

: Now, what sort of 8" floppy: Single sided; Double sided;
: Hard sectored; Soft sectored; Number of sectors; Tracks per
: inch ...?

I don't even want to think about having to deal with 8" floppies!! I had
some fun about 5 years ago when I retired an old Sun server because it wasn't
capable of running a y2k compliant OS. I shut it down and scrapped the server
but hung onto the SMD drives. Two monthes later I got a call from a user that
demanded that I reconnect the SMD drive to another server so she could recover
data from it.

As those of us in the IT field know and have been upfront about is media
obsolecenseSP? is an issue. Another problem is what to do with data that you
can read from the media but don't have the software to deal with the data. This
is of course a bigger issue then just what to do with digital images.
--




Keep working millions on welfare depend on you
-------------------

David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 10/18/2004 9:04 AM Tom Phillips spake thus:

The idiomatic use of the words "photo" and "photography"
in our society do not negate this intentional, original
application. Television cameramen are called "photographers"
rather than videographers. Movie makers are called photographers
rather than the more proper cinematographers. The term
photography and photographer is so diluted as to have
become meaninless in our society.

So are you one of those people who insist on calling tomatoes and peppers
"fruit"? Because technically they are. (The seeds of a plant and that which
contains them.) It's just that 99.95% of people misuse the term and insist on
calling them vegetables.

This is just as relevant as your insistence on the narrowest usage of
"photography". You may even be technically correct--who knows? (Or cares?)

If you really want to pursue this, I'd suggest going on over to
alt.usage.english and seeing what folks there have to say about it. Might be
interesting.

No need. English was my major (along with photography) in college.

And tomatoes are a fruit and most people know that.

I'd suggest we see what people think about the semantical differences
between a known troll and someone who just behaves like a troll...

David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 10/18/2004 9:04 AM Tom Phillips spake thus:

The idiomatic use of the words "photo" and "photography"
in our society do not negate this intentional, original
application. Television cameramen are called "photographers"
rather than videographers. Movie makers are called photographers
rather than the more proper cinematographers. The term
photography and photographer is so diluted as to have
become meaninless in our society.

So are you one of those people who insist on calling tomatoes and peppers
"fruit"? Because technically they are. (The seeds of a plant and that which
contains them.) It's just that 99.95% of people misuse the term and insist on
calling them vegetables.

This is just as relevant as your insistence on the narrowest usage of
"photography". You may even be technically correct--who knows? (Or cares?)

If you really want to pursue this, I'd suggest going on over to
alt.usage.english and seeing what folks there have to say about it. Might be
interesting.

No need. English was my major (along with photography) in college.

And tomatoes are a fruit and most people know that.

I'd suggest we see what people think about the semantical differences
between a known troll and someone who just behaves like a troll...

David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 10/18/2004 9:04 AM Tom Phillips spake thus:

The idiomatic use of the words "photo" and "photography"
in our society do not negate this intentional, original
application. Television cameramen are called "photographers"
rather than videographers. Movie makers are called photographers
rather than the more proper cinematographers. The term
photography and photographer is so diluted as to have
become meaninless in our society.

So are you one of those people who insist on calling tomatoes and peppers
"fruit"? Because technically they are. (The seeds of a plant and that which
contains them.) It's just that 99.95% of people misuse the term and insist on
calling them vegetables.

This is just as relevant as your insistence on the narrowest usage of
"photography". You may even be technically correct--who knows? (Or cares?)

If you really want to pursue this, I'd suggest going on over to
alt.usage.english and seeing what folks there have to say about it. Might be
interesting.

No need. English was my major (along with photography) in college.

And tomatoes are a fruit and most people know that.

I'd suggest we see what people think about the semantical differences
between a known troll and someone who just behaves like a troll...

David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 10/18/2004 9:04 AM Tom Phillips spake thus:

The idiomatic use of the words "photo" and "photography"
in our society do not negate this intentional, original
application. Television cameramen are called "photographers"
rather than videographers. Movie makers are called photographers
rather than the more proper cinematographers. The term
photography and photographer is so diluted as to have
become meaninless in our society.

So are you one of those people who insist on calling tomatoes and peppers
"fruit"? Because technically they are. (The seeds of a plant and that which
contains them.) It's just that 99.95% of people misuse the term and insist on
calling them vegetables.

This is just as relevant as your insistence on the narrowest usage of
"photography". You may even be technically correct--who knows? (Or cares?)

If you really want to pursue this, I'd suggest going on over to
alt.usage.english and seeing what folks there have to say about it. Might be
interesting.

No need. English was my major (along with photography) in college.

And tomatoes are a fruit and most people know that.

I'd suggest we see what people think about the semantical differences
between a known troll and someone who just behaves like a troll...