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Sixty-year-old undeveloped film



 
 
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  #11  
Old February 20th 04, 06:34 AM
Mark
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Default Sixty-year-old undeveloped film

"Richard Knoppow" wrote:

Its too bad the film is gone because the type of
perforations would tell the story.


Well, I probably _do_ have the film, since the cartridges were
in a box with numerous rolls of 35mm negatives. Let's see. . .
here's some "Agfa Supreme Pan" with the Bell & Howell perfs.
We have some "Agfa Plenachrome" with B&H perfs.
Here's some "Kodak Panchromatic Nitrate Film" with some
interior shots of my great-grandfather's liquor store in
Framingham, Mass. B&H perfs on that, as well as on the
"Eastman Panatomic." There's some "Super XX" with
Kodak perfs. A roll of "Superpan" with B&H perfs.
Something called "Plenachrome," also B&H perfs.
Yes, a veritable plethora of old film.

These sure are wound up tight. Any suggestions for how
to flatten them enough to get them into sleeves?

Thanks
-Mark


  #12  
Old February 22nd 04, 02:47 AM
Richard Knoppow
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Posts: n/a
Default Sixty-year-old undeveloped film


"Mark" wrote in message
...
"Richard Knoppow" wrote:

Its too bad the film is gone because the type of
perforations would tell the story.


Well, I probably _do_ have the film, since the cartridges

were
in a box with numerous rolls of 35mm negatives. Let's see.

.. .
here's some "Agfa Supreme Pan" with the Bell & Howell

perfs.
We have some "Agfa Plenachrome" with B&H perfs.
Here's some "Kodak Panchromatic Nitrate Film" with some
interior shots of my great-grandfather's liquor store in
Framingham, Mass. B&H perfs on that, as well as on the
"Eastman Panatomic." There's some "Super XX" with
Kodak perfs. A roll of "Superpan" with B&H perfs.
Something called "Plenachrome," also B&H perfs.
Yes, a veritable plethora of old film.

These sure are wound up tight. Any suggestions for how
to flatten them enough to get them into sleeves?

Thanks
-Mark

I may have old developing instuctions for some of these,
I'll check.
Some brief history. The German company Agfa bought out Ansco
in 1926 and operated it until the outbreak of WW-2 when it
was seized by the U.S.Government. The Agfa trade name
continued to be used until about late 1943. Ansco was the
oldest U.S. photographic manufacturing company dating to
around 1840. Agfa/Ansco made a wide variety of film and
paper; they were Kodak's chief competition.

Supreme Pan was a medium speed panchromatic film sold as
motion picture negative stock and also for 35mm still
cameras. It was their competition to Kodak SS Pan and Plus-X
motion picture films.

Plenachome was an orthochromatic (not red sensive) film for
box cameras, the competition to Kodak Verichrome. Agfa also
made a Fine-Grain Plenichrome for 35mm cameras.
Panatomic was a very slow very fine grain film, the
predecessor of Panatomic-X, probably about ISO-12

Kodak Super-XX was made until about twenty years ago. It
was a medium speed rather coarse grain film with excellent
tonal rendition and B&W to color rendition. Speed now would
be around ISO 150 or 200.

Agfa Superpan was a medium speed panchromatic roll film
with excellent tonal rendition, similar in speed and
application to Kodak Plus-X

I suspect these films date from the mid 1930's perhaps
sometime around 1936 to 1939. At that time some 35mm still
film was probably still sold with B&H perfs. Plenachrome was
never available as a motion picture stock so that must have
been the case.

About the only thing I can suggest for flattening the film
is to put into a chamber with very high humidity for a time.
Try hanging them in a small bathroom and turining on the how
water in the shower. The moisture should penetrate the
gelatin reasonably evenly, a small amount of weight on the
ends should pull them flat. Be careful since some of this
film may be pretty brittle. If so there is not much that can
be done for it.
The Kodak Panchromatic Nitrate film is almost certainly a
motion picture stock. Kodak stopped making nitrate for still
cameras, even 35mm cameras, sometime in the early 1930's.
All nitrate was discontinued in 1951 (trivia: Sunset
Boulevard was the last feature picture shot on nitrate).
Kodak's nitrate seems to be among the most stable but no
nitrate is very stable. Typical indications of decomposition
are brown patches, "rust" especially at the edges,
wavieness, and soemtimes, but not always, a camphor (moth
ball) odor. The fire danger from small amounts of nitrate is
not significant but it should still be stored in a
ventillated container so any evolved gasses can escape. Not
a problem for single strips of film or a few loose
negatives.
Safety base film can also decompose, as the motion picture
industry found to their horror recently. This applies to
still as well as motion picture film. Decomposing film will
look wrinkled and may have a vinegar odor. I think this is
mainly a problem with the tri-acetate films made after about
1945. In any case, the strong curl of your film _may_ be due
to this decomposition. If the negatives have any value I
suggest copying them as soon as possible.


--
---
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA



  #13  
Old February 22nd 04, 03:47 AM
Mark
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Posts: n/a
Default Sixty-year-old undeveloped film

"Richard Knoppow" wrote:

I may have old developing instuctions for some of these,
I'll check.


They're already developed. I am referring to the negative
strips. Sorry, I wasn't clear about that.

Some brief history. The German company Agfa bought out Ansco
in 1926 and operated it until the outbreak of WW-2 when it
was seized by the U.S.Government. The Agfa trade name
continued to be used until about late 1943. Ansco was the
oldest U.S. photographic manufacturing company dating to
around 1840. Agfa/Ansco made a wide variety of film and
paper; they were Kodak's chief competition.


Another item in this collection is a box of Agfa 2-1/2 x 3-1/2
sheet film (also already developed.) Here's the box (256k
download) with the Agfa/Ansco trade name:

http://www.lukejtornatzky.com/graphics/agfa_box.jpg

I suspect these films date from the mid 1930's perhaps
sometime around 1936 to 1939. At that time some 35mm still
film was probably still sold with B&H perfs. Plenachrome was
never available as a motion picture stock so that must have
been the case.


Those dates sound about right, considering my grandfather's
apparent age in some of the photos.

About the only thing I can suggest for flattening the film
is to put into a chamber with very high humidity for a time.
Try hanging them in a small bathroom and turining on the how
water in the shower.


Thanks, I'll try that.


  #14  
Old February 22nd 04, 08:30 AM
Richard Knoppow
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Sixty-year-old undeveloped film

"Mark" wrote in message ...
"Richard Knoppow" wrote:

I may have old developing instuctions for some of these,
I'll check.


They're already developed. I am referring to the negative
strips. Sorry, I wasn't clear about that.

Actually my fault for not reading more carefully.


Some brief history. The German company Agfa bought out Ansco
in 1926 and operated it until the outbreak of WW-2 when it
was seized by the U.S.Government. The Agfa trade name
continued to be used until about late 1943. Ansco was the
oldest U.S. photographic manufacturing company dating to
around 1840. Agfa/Ansco made a wide variety of film and
paper; they were Kodak's chief competition.


Another item in this collection is a box of Agfa 2-1/2 x 3-1/2
sheet film (also already developed.) Here's the box (256k
download) with the Agfa/Ansco trade name:

http://www.lukejtornatzky.com/graphics/agfa_box.jpg

Interesting. Agfa Superpan Press was a fairly fast film for press
and industrial photography. It was Agfa's competition to Kodak Super
Panchro Press Type-B. Superpan Press also seems to have been a popular
portrait film judging from the technical data from publications like
_U.S.Camera Annual_. Sometime in the early to mid 1930's (I don't
remember the date) Agfa developed the use of Gold sensitizer which
immediately nearly doubled the speed of their films without increasing
grain. It caught Kodak with their pants down and it took them a while
to catch up. By 1940 Kodak was again making the fastest film on the
market. This was sold under the name Super Panchro Press, Sports Type.
This had a speed of probably about ISO 400 to 600. Remarkable stuff
for the time but evidently fussy. BTW the Type-B on Super Panchro
Press means its color sensitivity. Kodak devided panchromatic films
into three groups; A, B, and C, in order of increasing red
sensitivity. Type-A were the first pan films, which did not have very
high sensitivity to red light. Type-B is a medium red sensitivity
film, most current pan films are Type-B. Type-C was a high red
sensitivity film. Currently Kodak Technical Pan is about the only
Type-C film but in the past Kodak made others since it was evidently
difficult to make a film with very high overall sensitivity without
unbalancing the red end of the spectrum. I don't know if Agfa/Ansco
made any Type-C films but they did not classify their films as Kodak
did.
The 1940 date peeking out from the torn label suggests the film was
sold perhaps a year earlier. These are truely bits of the past and I
would preserve them.

Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA

 




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