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#11
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Turning film cameras into digital cameras
On Apr 6, 11:05 pm, Charles wrote:
On 6 Apr 2007 19:28:31 -0700, wrote: Let's for the moment we think "out of the box". If there is a product which has the shape of either a 35 mm or 120 film cartridge, and you can just load it into your old film camera. However, this product acts like a digital "film", in which it will store images in digital format, instead of into film, would you buy such a product? It is just exactly like your old film cartridge, put into the back of your camera, set the camera as it has a film in it, advance the lever , take photos, go to next shot, etc. The difference would be when you complete the shots (24 or 36 exposure), you connect this cartridge to your computer and downloaded the digital data, just like a media card in your digital cameras. This product would be re-used again and again, just like the digital cameras. Some of you may said that is the same question whether there is a "back cartridge" that can be fitted into the old Hasselblad, Mamiya RB or M645, in which it changes into digital cameras. However, I heard that this speacil back is very expensive. Correct me if such a product exist for professional photographers, but at a very high costs! (such that it is just easier to throw away the old cameras and buy a new digital one). The next question is whether technically this is possible. Will people buy them, and use their old cameras (which some had invested heavily before the digital era came to play). This sounds like a crazy idea, but I sometime wonder that if it is possible. There are lots of smart people and inventors in this world, and I am sure they have the brain to create such a product. I am sure that this would not be welcomed by digital cameras' manufacturers, as it will compete with their product. Although some of the "players" are still the same (Kodak, Fuji, Nikon, Canon, Pentax, etc). Unfortunately, we are living in a world which are driven by narrow "track of minds", set by big corporations which decided upon our direction into the future. Thanks for sharing my "dream". I am now awake from my day dreaming. Thanks for the discussion. Sounds like the old "silicon film." http://www.dpreview.com/news/0109/01...mvaporizes.asp Thanks for the reference to the "silicon film", Honestly, I never heard that before. Again, there are people out there who have thought ideas like this. However, I wonder why this particular idea became "cold". Could it be for one or more of the following reasons? - it was not developed by a big corporation with big dollar. Would it make any difference if it was developed by Fuji or Kodak? - Big camera companies may oppose the idea, as they have their own agenda, or want to sell more digital cameras (therefore provide "barrier" instead of promoting it). - Expensive cost to develop, as well as to market against those selling digital camera. Remember those new 35 mm film system, which did not seem to "fly" just before the digital world take over... I even forget the name... the one that can be printed in various sizes? - Too restrictive of a product - i.e. the EFS (e-film) was only targetted for specific cameras only. The idea of the silicon film/e- film (after I read a PDF file from the developer in the web) was to have the product ready for only certain Nikon and Canon 35 mm cameras. My thinking was different. The product that I have in mind (similar to the EFS or silicon film), is not only that it looks similar to the existing 35 mm camera cartridge, it should function to ANY 35 mm cameras... not just certain brand of camera. If Kodak/Fuji can sell a 35 mm film cartridge and fit to any cameras, why the silicon film can work only for certain cameras?. I think this is the main drawback. Perhaps with newer technology, the idea can be re-introduced and improvement to the silicon film can be made? Or they "missed the train" already? I still think it is a neat idea, but it has to be relatively cheap to compete with the current market. Thanks for all replies in these newsgroups! |
#12
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Turning film cameras into digital cameras
In article .com,
wrote: Thanks for the reference to the "silicon film", Honestly, I never heard that before. Again, there are people out there who have thought ideas like this. However, I wonder why this particular idea became "cold". Could it be for one or more of the following reasons? the main reason is that it requires physical modification to the camera for it to work. the surface of film is light sensitive, whereas the surface of a sensor is not - it has the bayer filters, micro-lenses, anti-alias filter and infrared cut filter in front of the actual light sensitive layer. thus, one can't just put a filter up against the film rails and expect things to be in focus - it would need to fit further forward. that means either milling the film rails or fit the whole unit within the film opening so the focal plane is physically in the right place. unfortunately, there's a shutter mechanism that gets in the way of doing that. if that problem was somehow solved, there would still need to be some sort of communication between the camera and the device so it knew when to read an image and store it. and then there's little things like a fixed white balance and fixed iso rating when it is the camera (just like film). or a readout for number of pictures available and battery level. other than that, it is a good idea. |
#13
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Turning film cameras into digital cameras
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#14
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Turning film cameras into digital cameras
On Apr 6, 9:28 pm, wrote:
Let's for the moment we think "out of the box". If there is a product which has the shape of either a 35 mm or 120 film cartridge, and you can just load it into your old film camera. However, this product acts like a digital "film", in which it will store images in digital format, instead of into film, would you buy such a product? It is just exactly like your old film cartridge, put into the back of your camera, set the camera as it has a film in it, advance the lever , take photos, go to next shot, etc. The difference would be when you complete the shots (24 or 36 exposure), you connect this cartridge to your computer and downloaded the digital data, just like a media card in your digital cameras. This product would be re-used again and again, just like the digital cameras. Some of you may said that is the same question whether there is a "back cartridge" that can be fitted into the old Hasselblad, Mamiya RB or M645, in which it changes into digital cameras. However, I heard that this speacil back is very expensive. Correct me if such a product exist for professional photographers, but at a very high costs! (such that it is just easier to throw away the old cameras and buy a new digital one). The next question is whether technically this is possible. Will people buy them, and use their old cameras (which some had invested heavily before the digital era came to play). This sounds like a crazy idea, but I sometime wonder that if it is possible. There are lots of smart people and inventors in this world, and I am sure they have the brain to create such a product. I am sure that this would not be welcomed by digital cameras' manufacturers, as it will compete with their product. Although some of the "players" are still the same (Kodak, Fuji, Nikon, Canon, Pentax, etc). Unfortunately, we are living in a world which are driven by narrow "track of minds", set by big corporations which decided upon our direction into the future. Thanks for sharing my "dream". I am now awake from my day dreaming. Thanks for the discussion. Several years ago the group was flooded with questions based on a premature release of such a product. I seem to recall they called it "silicon film". Never went on sale- the effort folded. I believe, for one thing, that the development took so long that the resolution was far bypassed by the pure digital cameras. But I think there were other problems too. |
#15
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Turning film cameras into digital cameras
On Apr 6, 10:28 pm, wrote:
Let's for the moment we think "out of the box". If there is a product which has the shape of either a 35 mm or 120 film cartridge, and you can just load it into your old film camera. However, this product acts like a digital "film", in which it will store images in digital format, instead of into film, would you buy such a product? Forget that, simply replace the back of any SLR with one housing a sensor. Just think of the ease of sensor cleaning! Swing the back open! The idea of doing this with an Olympus OM-1 was bandied about, but the logistics would have been daunting. |
#16
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Turning film cameras into digital cameras
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#17
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Turning film cameras into digital cameras
On Apr 7, 11:21 am, Gisle Hannemyr wrote:
Kodak used to make digital backs for some Nikon film bodies. At the link below is a photo of my Nikon N90s fitted with a Kodak DCS 460 digital back:http://hannemyr.com/photo/dcs460.html It was somewhat bigger than a film cartridge, tho'. The Leica R8 and R9 also has a replaceable back, and can be fitted with the DMR ro shoot digital, or a film back to shoot film. -- - gisle hannemyr [ gisle{at}hannemyr.no -http://hannemyr.com/photo/] ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Sigma SD10, Kodak DCS460, Canon Powershot G5, Olympus 2020Z ------------------------------------------------------------------------ I was wondering about this very thing a few days ago. Your Kodak conversion makes pretty good images. I would give my bad eye for an F3hp viewfinder on my digital Nik... If the current crop of DSLRs follows the same price curve...a d200 will sell for 50$ in ten years... and so will a cheesburger OY! Jazz |
#18
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Turning film cameras into digital cameras
"nospam" wrote in message ... In article .com, wrote: the main reason is that it requires physical modification to the camera for it to work. the surface of film is light sensitive, whereas the surface of a sensor is not - it has the bayer filters, micro-lenses, anti-alias filter and infrared cut filter in front of the actual light sensitive layer. thus, one can't just put a filter up against the film rails and expect things to be in focus - it would need to fit further forward. that means either milling the film rails or fit the whole unit within the film opening so the focal plane is physically in the right place. unfortunately, there's a shutter mechanism that gets in the way of doing that. Could it work with medium format TLRs? The shutter is in the lens. That old Rolleiflex in the closet could have a new life as a digital camera. There would also be more room for the support hardware. The sensor could be something less than 6x6 film size and the surrounding area could poke into the camera a little further to accommodate a hardware enclosure, and the spool chambers could also house hardware. SW |
#19
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Turning film cameras into digital cameras
In article , Summer
Wind wrote: Could it work with medium format TLRs? The shutter is in the lens. That old Rolleiflex in the closet could have a new life as a digital camera. There would also be more room for the support hardware. The sensor could be something less than 6x6 film size and the surrounding area could poke into the camera a little further to accommodate a hardware enclosure, and the spool chambers could also house hardware. there already are medium format digital backs: http://www.phaseone.com/Content/p1di...eries/Compatib ility%20chart.aspx |
#20
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Turning film cameras into digital cameras
"nospam" wrote in message
... In article , Summer Wind wrote: Could it work with medium format TLRs? The shutter is in the lens. That old Rolleiflex in the closet could have a new life as a digital camera. There would also be more room for the support hardware. The sensor could be something less than 6x6 film size and the surrounding area could poke into the camera a little further to accommodate a hardware enclosure, and the spool chambers could also house hardware. there already are medium format digital backs: For TLRs? There have been MF SLR digital backs for years, but I don't recall one for TLRs. Your link did not work, by the way. SW |
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