This is insane - On1 Photo Raw crashes

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 05:23:52 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 03:26:50 -0400,
wrote:

In iganews.com,
Savageduck wrote:


2017-07-23 16:05:07 ONQtServer - ONQtServer listening on 58949

this one caught my eye, and after a bit of digging, sure enough,
they're using qt, a cross-platform framework. that's not a good sign,
as apps written using qt generally suck in all sorts of ways.

on the other hand, it has two analytics frameworks, so they know about
the crashes.

interestingly enough, there is a file in the raw framework that
describes the bayer grid for various cameras, and the k3 and k5 are
arranged differently. it doesn't actually matter as long as the raw
converter knows how to process it, but curious nonetheless.

English only please...

But more to the point, if I'm not willing to buy a new video card,
should I dump this software?

It is fundamentally good at what it does, and On1 is usually responsive to
this sort of issue, so I would at least find out what On1 support has to say
before abandoning it. After all, you have paid for it.

I don't think they're very responsive at the moment. Looking again at
their first response to my email, it's clear that they were not
responding to my issues, but simply replying with boilerplate fixes
for crashes. I've sent 3 more emails, and there still has never been
any direct response to what I was asking, and no response at all past
that first one.

Try writing directly to this guy, Nathan Keudell:


The other point might be, you may well have a dying video card in need of
replacement, and On1 Photo RAW has merely revealed a hardware issue. Just
another thought.

Well, that's not a bad thought. I have had for a couple of years an
issue with the display blacking out for very short times, but I cannot
duplicate it, and therefore can't substitute another monitor. So I
could have a bad processor or monitor, but I have no idea which.

Looking around a bit, I guess I could get a better card for under
$150, so it might be worth it. There are a couple of things that are a
bit balky in LR, so it might help with those things, too.

BTW: Have you tried accessing your Pentax RAW files via the LR On1 Photo RAW
2017 plug-in?

--

Regards,
Savageduck

On Aug 3, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 05:23:52 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 03:26:50 -0400,
wrote:

In iganews.com,
Savageduck wrote:


2017-07-23 16:05:07 ONQtServer - ONQtServer listening on 58949

this one caught my eye, and after a bit of digging, sure enough,
they're using qt, a cross-platform framework. that's not a good sign,
as apps written using qt generally suck in all sorts of ways.

on the other hand, it has two analytics frameworks, so they know about
the crashes.

interestingly enough, there is a file in the raw framework that
describes the bayer grid for various cameras, and the k3 and k5 are
arranged differently. it doesn't actually matter as long as the raw
converter knows how to process it, but curious nonetheless.

English only please...

But more to the point, if I'm not willing to buy a new video card,
should I dump this software?

It is fundamentally good at what it does, and On1 is usually responsive to
this sort of issue, so I would at least find out what On1 support has to
say
before abandoning it. After all, you have paid for it.

I don't think they're very responsive at the moment. Looking again at
their first response to my email, it's clear that they were not
responding to my issues, but simply replying with boilerplate fixes
for crashes. I've sent 3 more emails, and there still has never been
any direct response to what I was asking, and no response at all past
that first one.

Try writing directly to this guy, Nathan Keudell:


This the other individual who has been helpful for me (but that was back in
November 2016).
J Michael (on1

The other point might be, you may well have a dying video card in need of
replacement, and On1 Photo RAW has merely revealed a hardware issue. Just
another thought.

Well, that's not a bad thought. I have had for a couple of years an
issue with the display blacking out for very short times, but I cannot
duplicate it, and therefore can't substitute another monitor. So I
could have a bad processor or monitor, but I have no idea which.

Looking around a bit, I guess I could get a better card for under
$150, so it might be worth it. There are a couple of things that are a
bit balky in LR, so it might help with those things, too.

BTW: Have you tried accessing your Pentax RAW files via the LR On1 Photo RAW
2017 plug-in?

--

Regards,
Savageduck

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 18:57:00 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Aug 3, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 05:23:52 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 03:26:50 -0400,
wrote:

In iganews.com,
Savageduck wrote:


2017-07-23 16:05:07 ONQtServer - ONQtServer listening on 58949

this one caught my eye, and after a bit of digging, sure enough,
they're using qt, a cross-platform framework. that's not a good sign,
as apps written using qt generally suck in all sorts of ways.

on the other hand, it has two analytics frameworks, so they know about
the crashes.

interestingly enough, there is a file in the raw framework that
describes the bayer grid for various cameras, and the k3 and k5 are
arranged differently. it doesn't actually matter as long as the raw
converter knows how to process it, but curious nonetheless.

English only please...

But more to the point, if I'm not willing to buy a new video card,
should I dump this software?

It is fundamentally good at what it does, and On1 is usually responsive to
this sort of issue, so I would at least find out what On1 support has to
say
before abandoning it. After all, you have paid for it.

I don't think they're very responsive at the moment. Looking again at
their first response to my email, it's clear that they were not
responding to my issues, but simply replying with boilerplate fixes
for crashes. I've sent 3 more emails, and there still has never been
any direct response to what I was asking, and no response at all past
that first one.

Try writing directly to this guy, Nathan Keudell:


This the other individual who has been helpful for me (but that was back in
November 2016).
J Michael (on1

I appreciate both the names. I'll try them tomorrow or next week. I
sent one more email today to support asking if anyone was going to
bother replying to me.


The other point might be, you may well have a dying video card in need of
replacement, and On1 Photo RAW has merely revealed a hardware issue. Just
another thought.

Well, that's not a bad thought. I have had for a couple of years an
issue with the display blacking out for very short times, but I cannot
duplicate it, and therefore can't substitute another monitor. So I
could have a bad processor or monitor, but I have no idea which.

Looking around a bit, I guess I could get a better card for under
$150, so it might be worth it. There are a couple of things that are a
bit balky in LR, so it might help with those things, too.

BTW: Have you tried accessing your Pentax RAW files via the LR On1 Photo RAW
2017 plug-in?

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 18:57:00 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Aug 3, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 05:23:52 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 03:26:50 -0400,
wrote:

In iganews.com,
Savageduck wrote:


2017-07-23 16:05:07 ONQtServer - ONQtServer listening on 58949

this one caught my eye, and after a bit of digging, sure enough,
they're using qt, a cross-platform framework. that's not a good sign,
as apps written using qt generally suck in all sorts of ways.

on the other hand, it has two analytics frameworks, so they know about
the crashes.

interestingly enough, there is a file in the raw framework that
describes the bayer grid for various cameras, and the k3 and k5 are
arranged differently. it doesn't actually matter as long as the raw
converter knows how to process it, but curious nonetheless.

English only please...

But more to the point, if I'm not willing to buy a new video card,
should I dump this software?

It is fundamentally good at what it does, and On1 is usually responsive
to
this sort of issue, so I would at least find out what On1 support has to
say
before abandoning it. After all, you have paid for it.

I don't think they're very responsive at the moment. Looking again at
their first response to my email, it's clear that they were not
responding to my issues, but simply replying with boilerplate fixes
for crashes. I've sent 3 more emails, and there still has never been
any direct response to what I was asking, and no response at all past
that first one.

Try writing directly to this guy, Nathan Keudell:


This the other individual who has been helpful for me (but that was back in
November 2016).
J Michael (on1

I appreciate both the names. I'll try them tomorrow or next week. I
sent one more email today to support asking if anyone was going to
bother replying to me.

J Michael lists himself as *Support Manager* so a complaint regarding lack of
response might hit close to home. Though in the couple of times I contacted
them they followed up promptly.
I believe that Nathan Keudell is higher up on the food chain.


The other point might be, you may well have a dying video card in need of
replacement, and On1 Photo RAW has merely revealed a hardware issue. Just
another thought.

Well, that's not a bad thought. I have had for a couple of years an
issue with the display blacking out for very short times, but I cannot
duplicate it, and therefore can't substitute another monitor. So I
could have a bad processor or monitor, but I have no idea which.

Looking around a bit, I guess I could get a better card for under
$150, so it might be worth it. There are a couple of things that are a
bit balky in LR, so it might help with those things, too.

BTW: Have you tried accessing your Pentax RAW files via the LR On1 Photo
RAW
2017 plug-in?

--

Regards,
Savageduck

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 13:58:53 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 05:23:52 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 03:26:50 -0400,
wrote:

In iganews.com,
Savageduck wrote:


2017-07-23 16:05:07 ONQtServer - ONQtServer listening on 58949

this one caught my eye, and after a bit of digging, sure enough,
they're using qt, a cross-platform framework. that's not a good sign,
as apps written using qt generally suck in all sorts of ways.

on the other hand, it has two analytics frameworks, so they know about
the crashes.

interestingly enough, there is a file in the raw framework that
describes the bayer grid for various cameras, and the k3 and k5 are
arranged differently. it doesn't actually matter as long as the raw
converter knows how to process it, but curious nonetheless.

English only please...

But more to the point, if I'm not willing to buy a new video card,
should I dump this software?

It is fundamentally good at what it does, and On1 is usually responsive to
this sort of issue, so I would at least find out what On1 support has to say
before abandoning it. After all, you have paid for it.

I don't think they're very responsive at the moment. Looking again at
their first response to my email, it's clear that they were not
responding to my issues, but simply replying with boilerplate fixes
for crashes. I've sent 3 more emails, and there still has never been
any direct response to what I was asking, and no response at all past
that first one.

Try writing directly to this guy, Nathan Keudell:


The other point might be, you may well have a dying video card in need of
replacement, and On1 Photo RAW has merely revealed a hardware issue. Just
another thought.

Well, that's not a bad thought. I have had for a couple of years an
issue with the display blacking out for very short times, but I cannot
duplicate it, and therefore can't substitute another monitor. So I
could have a bad processor or monitor, but I have no idea which.

Looking around a bit, I guess I could get a better card for under
$150, so it might be worth it. There are a couple of things that are a
bit balky in LR, so it might help with those things, too.

BTW: Have you tried accessing your Pentax RAW files via the LR On1 Photo RAW
2017 plug-in?

Just now. It works - I did a test resize. Resize is still pretty slow,
but I did do an extreme test.

I'm convinced now that it's a memory leak. I can no longer duplicate
the issue exactly. When I first started, that red car only thing
happened over and over and over no matter how many times I closed and
opened the program. That would be a very unlikely coincidence, but I
guess it's possible. The only thing that's consistent now is that if I
keep selecting, zooming and unzooming photos, it will crash, usually
within about 20 photos. I also have to think it will happen with the
K5 16MP photos if I spend enough time. Maybe even jpg's. I might try
later.

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 19:30:39 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 18:57:00 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Aug 3, 2017, Savageduck wrote
(in iganews.com):

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 05:23:52 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 03:26:50 -0400,
wrote:

In iganews.com,
Savageduck wrote:


2017-07-23 16:05:07 ONQtServer - ONQtServer listening on 58949

this one caught my eye, and after a bit of digging, sure enough,
they're using qt, a cross-platform framework. that's not a good sign,
as apps written using qt generally suck in all sorts of ways.

on the other hand, it has two analytics frameworks, so they know about
the crashes.

interestingly enough, there is a file in the raw framework that
describes the bayer grid for various cameras, and the k3 and k5 are
arranged differently. it doesn't actually matter as long as the raw
converter knows how to process it, but curious nonetheless.

English only please...

But more to the point, if I'm not willing to buy a new video card,
should I dump this software?

It is fundamentally good at what it does, and On1 is usually responsive
to
this sort of issue, so I would at least find out what On1 support has to
say
before abandoning it. After all, you have paid for it.

I don't think they're very responsive at the moment. Looking again at
their first response to my email, it's clear that they were not
responding to my issues, but simply replying with boilerplate fixes
for crashes. I've sent 3 more emails, and there still has never been
any direct response to what I was asking, and no response at all past
that first one.

Try writing directly to this guy, Nathan Keudell:


This the other individual who has been helpful for me (but that was back in
November 2016).
J Michael (on1

I appreciate both the names. I'll try them tomorrow or next week. I
sent one more email today to support asking if anyone was going to
bother replying to me.

J Michael lists himself as *Support Manager* so a complaint regarding lack of
response might hit close to home. Though in the couple of times I contacted
them they followed up promptly.
I believe that Nathan Keudell is higher up on the food chain.


The other point might be, you may well have a dying video card in need of
replacement, and On1 Photo RAW has merely revealed a hardware issue. Just
another thought.

Well, that's not a bad thought. I have had for a couple of years an
issue with the display blacking out for very short times, but I cannot
duplicate it, and therefore can't substitute another monitor. So I
could have a bad processor or monitor, but I have no idea which.

Looking around a bit, I guess I could get a better card for under
$150, so it might be worth it. There are a couple of things that are a
bit balky in LR, so it might help with those things, too.

BTW: Have you tried accessing your Pentax RAW files via the LR On1 Photo
RAW
2017 plug-in?

I mentioned in another reply that I was going to try more photos, both
jpg's and K5 (smaller photos), and sure enough, I am now convinced
it's a memory leak. It took a LOT more photos to make it happen, but
the same sort of crash happened.

It has also crossed my mind that no one would have any reason to keep
opening, zooming, and moving on to the next photo over and over, but
at the same time, that's not how I first saw it, and I had no reason
to keep zooming into photos. Anyway, I would probably never see this
in normal use, at least not the way it's working now. But I hate the
thought of doing a lot of work on a photo, only to have the program
crash. I do think, though, that I did not lose the changes I made
after any of the crashes.

When you are using the filmstrip view, how long does it take to move
to the next photo? It takes about 2 full seconds on mine when it's
working properly. I think that's really slow, but if it's normal,
maybe a new video card won't make any difference. LR isn't much
faster, either.

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 19:30:39 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

BTW: Have you tried accessing your Pentax RAW files via the LR On1 Photo
RAW
2017 plug-in?

I mentioned in another reply that I was going to try more photos, both
jpg's and K5 (smaller photos), and sure enough, I am now convinced
it's a memory leak. It took a LOT more photos to make it happen, but
the same sort of crash happened.

It has also crossed my mind that no one would have any reason to keep
opening, zooming, and moving on to the next photo over and over, but
at the same time, that's not how I first saw it, and I had no reason
to keep zooming into photos.

That does seem a tad OCD.

Anyway, I would probably never see this
in normal use, at least not the way it's working now. But I hate the
thought of doing a lot of work on a photo, only to have the program
crash. I do think, though, that I did not lose the changes I made
after any of the crashes.

When you are using the filmstrip view, how long does it take to move
to the next photo?

For me in Browse mode, moving between photos is immediate. In Develop mode it
takes 2-4 seconds depending on file size.

It takes about 2 full seconds on mine when it's
working properly. I think that's really slow, but if it's normal,
maybe a new video card won't make any difference. LR isn't much
faster, either.

--

Regards,
Savageduck

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 20:31:03 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 19:30:39 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

BTW: Have you tried accessing your Pentax RAW files via the LR On1 Photo
RAW
2017 plug-in?

I mentioned in another reply that I was going to try more photos, both
jpg's and K5 (smaller photos), and sure enough, I am now convinced
it's a memory leak. It took a LOT more photos to make it happen, but
the same sort of crash happened.

It has also crossed my mind that no one would have any reason to keep
opening, zooming, and moving on to the next photo over and over, but
at the same time, that's not how I first saw it, and I had no reason
to keep zooming into photos.

That does seem a tad OCD.

Anyway, I would probably never see this
in normal use, at least not the way it's working now. But I hate the
thought of doing a lot of work on a photo, only to have the program
crash. I do think, though, that I did not lose the changes I made
after any of the crashes.

When you are using the filmstrip view, how long does it take to move
to the next photo?

For me in Browse mode, moving between photos is immediate. In Develop mode it
takes 2-4 seconds depending on file size.

It takes about 2 full seconds on mine when it's
working properly. I think that's really slow, but if it's normal,
maybe a new video card won't make any difference. LR isn't much
faster, either.

I moved on to trying to use it in a normal manner, and it is easily
the buggiest software I have ever used. I might uninstall, and then
reinstall like they suggested, but I can't see that helping. It now
stops selecting photos in either mode, and the mouse cursor keeps
switching between the hand tool and zoom tool with each click, but it
won't select a new photo. I wasn't doing anything unusual, just moving
around to different photos, and different modules - no zooming at all.
And I have 32GB of memory. It makes no sense at all.

I was also trying to see if it is 32 or 64 bit software, but there are
no choices when downloading. It installs in the folder that has the 64
bit programs, so I assume the only option is 64 bit, but I don't see
that mentioned in the requirements.

I'm too old for this. All of my other software works just fine on that
PC, and some of it is pretty demanding, including video editing
software.

In article , Bill W
wrote:

2017-07-23 16:05:07 ONQtServer - ONQtServer listening on 58949

this one caught my eye, and after a bit of digging, sure enough,
they're using qt, a cross-platform framework. that's not a good sign,
as apps written using qt generally suck in all sorts of ways.

qt is one of several third party cross-platform frameworks that allow
developers to build an app for multiple platforms without rewriting it
natively for each one. that makes their life easier, not yours.

the downside is it brings all sorts of compromises, including that the
resulting app won't look, feel or be as responsive as a native app. it
also means that its features are usually the lowest common denominator
of all platforms. anything unique to one platform, no matter how useful
or powerful it might be, can't be used because it's not available on
all of the other platforms.

the end result is a substandard app for everyone.

Yeah, I Googled it after I first replied. I stumbled across a site
where programmers were arguing whether is should be used, and there is
no agreement, except that as you say, there are tradeoffs.

everything has tradeoffs.

I also saw
at least a few comments about memory usage issues, but they tended to
blame the fact that QT uses C++.

that has more to do with ineptness than c++, which is designed to avoid
memory issues.

Whatever, a bug is a bug, and On1 has
them, whether they screwed up with QT or with C++.

everything has bugs.

the problem is that on1 can only fix their own bugs, not those in qt or
any other third party library.

the best they can do is complain to qt and hope it gets fixed in a
timely manner. if not (as is often the case), they have to come up with
a workaround, or worst case, seek alternatives.

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 20:31:03 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

On Aug 3, 2017, Bill W wrote
(in ):

On Thu, 03 Aug 2017 19:30:39 -0700, Savageduck
wrote:

BTW: Have you tried accessing your Pentax RAW files via the LR On1
Photo
RAW
2017 plug-in?

I mentioned in another reply that I was going to try more photos, both
jpg's and K5 (smaller photos), and sure enough, I am now convinced
it's a memory leak. It took a LOT more photos to make it happen, but
the same sort of crash happened.

It has also crossed my mind that no one would have any reason to keep
opening, zooming, and moving on to the next photo over and over, but
at the same time, that's not how I first saw it, and I had no reason
to keep zooming into photos.

That does seem a tad OCD.

Anyway, I would probably never see this
in normal use, at least not the way it's working now. But I hate the
thought of doing a lot of work on a photo, only to have the program
crash. I do think, though, that I did not lose the changes I made
after any of the crashes.

When you are using the filmstrip view, how long does it take to move
to the next photo?

For me in Browse mode, moving between photos is immediate. In Develop mode
it
takes 2-4 seconds depending on file size.

It takes about 2 full seconds on mine when it's
working properly. I think that's really slow, but if it's normal,
maybe a new video card won't make any difference. LR isn't much
faster, either.

I moved on to trying to use it in a normal manner, and it is easily
the buggiest software I have ever used. I might uninstall, and then
reinstall like they suggested, but I can't see that helping. It now
stops selecting photos in either mode, and the mouse cursor keeps
switching between the hand tool and zoom tool with each click, but it
won't select a new photo. I wasn't doing anything unusual, just moving
around to different photos, and different modules - no zooming at all.
And have 32GB of memory. It makes no sense at all.

That is not normal operation. They might actually know something with the
uninstall/reinstall advice. It can’t do any harm to follow that advice, and
if you don’t do it, guess what the first question they ask is going to be.

I was also trying to see if it is 32 or 64 bit software, but there are
no choices when downloading. It installs in the folder that has the 64
bit programs, so I assume the only option is 64 bit, but I don't see
that mentioned in the requirements.

I have always thought of this as a 64 bit app.

I'm too old for this. All of my other software works just fine on that
PC, and some of it is pretty demanding, including video editing
software.

Yup! I road test, and use quite a lot of software, and it is frustrating when
one does not deliver as advertised.

--

Regards,
Savageduck