A Photography forum. PhotoBanter.com

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » PhotoBanter.com forum » Digital Photography » Digital Photography
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

iOS 11 and macOS High Sierra



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old June 7th 17, 04:36 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24,165
Default iOS 11 and macOS High Sierra

In article , PAS wrote:

I thought the quote from the head of marketing,
referring to the HomePod speakers, put it in a
nutshell:

"You don't have to know what any of that is; just
know that it sounds incredible"


The HomePod has better specs than the Echo or Google Home in it's build
quality. The HomePod is larger than the other two which allows for a
larger subwoofer. it also has seven tweeters. No one has been able to
report on it's sound quality yet but I expect it to be better than
either the Echo or Google Home.


some journalists have heard it, although not in ideal conditions and
certainly not in their own home.

If it's worth almost three times the
price of the Google Home or double the price of the Echo is a question
for the user to answer.


yep. it also does a lot more.

Microsoft's Cortana enabled device is made by
Harman Kardon and I expect it to have superior sound qaulity to the Echo
and Goold Home just as the HomePod will. It most likely will have a
price closer to the HomePod.


probably.

Amazon allows the smart assistant to be used by third party
manufacturers and there are thousands of "skills" it has. It has a leg
up on all the other assistants because of that. We all know how much of
a "closed" system the HomePod will be so it remains to be seen how fast
the functionality of the HomePod can even come close to an Echo or
Google Home.


it's not closed. developers can add siri functionality if they want,
which will be usable from a homepod, iphone, ipad and mac.
  #22  
Old June 7th 17, 04:36 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24,165
Default iOS 11 and macOS High Sierra

In article .com,
Savageduck wrote:

On Jun 7, 2017, Tony Cooper wrote
(in ):
If Live Photos is a mode that can be turned on or off, it would seem
that this adds battery drain when it is on.

Yes or no?

no.

there is no reason why it would.

I'm not "claiming" it is draining the battery, but am asking why the
battery is not increasing in use because the camera is recording that
extra 1.5 seconds at all times when that mode is on.

because it's not recording anything unless you actually take a photo.

the live preview, which occurs any time the camera app is open, is
buffered in memory for autofocus, autoexposure, face detection, special
effects and much more, whether or not live photos is on or off.

if live photos is off, just the photo is saved to flash.

if live photos is on, then the photo plus the last 1.5 seconds of the
memory buffer is saved, plus the following 1.5 seconds unless the
camera moved enough to where the video is no longer relevant. {*]

even if you don't take any photos at all, the phone is still using
power to run the camera app, get data from the sensor, display it on
the screen, etc.

the amount of power to write a file to flash, even if the file is
slightly bigger when it contains video, is negligible compared to
everything else that's going on.


If I read that correctly, the answer to my question is "Yes", not
"No", but the contention is that the battery drain is negligible and -
assumedly - will not affect the phone's performance.


Correct.


tony's interpretation is not correct.
  #23  
Old June 7th 17, 04:36 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24,165
Default iOS 11 and macOS High Sierra

In article ,
Sandman wrote:

If Live Photos is a mode that can be turned on or off, it would
seem that this adds battery drain when it is on.

Yes or no?

no.


there is no reason why it would.


I'm not "claiming" it is draining the battery, but am asking why the
battery is not increasing in use because the camera is recording
that extra 1.5 seconds at all times when that mode is on.


Obviously live photo takes more battery power than not using it - from the
assumption that if you turn it off, the buffer isn't used at all.


the buffer is not turned off. it's always being used for various things.

When the camera app is active, the camera sensor is being read from and is
being displayed live on the display. The iPhone 7 Plus display is 2
megapixels, so obviously the entire camera sensor image is not streamed as-is
to the screen, it's a scaled-down version. The buffer contains 3 seconds of
12 megapixel images. It captures these at 15 fps, so you get a total of 45
12MP images when taking one shot.

Obviously, buffering and saving 45 12MP images takes processing power which
in turn consumes battery (and storage space). I would assume that this is
very marginal though, and like I said, it assumes that this buffer isn't
always used even when the user elects these images not to be saved, which it
could be, if the user has turned live photos OFF and the buffer is still
there, the camera app could do a quick analysis of the buffer to select the
least blurry photo for instance, which may have been four frames before (or
after) the user actually pressed the shutter button.


the buffer is always in use.

In that case, there would be no difference other than in storage space.


that is correct.
  #24  
Old June 7th 17, 04:36 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24,165
Default iOS 11 and macOS High Sierra

In article , Tony Cooper
wrote:


In that case, there would be no difference other than in storage space.


I'm not claiming that leaving the feature on is a problem. It just
didn't seem logical to me that leaving the feature on does not result
in *some* battery drain. If the battery drain is minimal, and doesn't
affect the performance of the phone, then it's not a problem.


it's not only minimal, but it's too small to be measured.

the write is done in a fraction of a second. you'd need a *lot* of
photos to for the difference to be one second. meanwhile, the battery
lasts 1-2 *days* in normal use.
  #25  
Old June 7th 17, 04:47 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
android
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,854
Default iOS 11 and macOS High Sierra

In article ,
Tony Cooper wrote:

In that case, there would be no difference other than in storage space.


I'm not claiming that leaving the feature on is a problem. It just
didn't seem logical to me that leaving the feature on does not result
in *some* battery drain.


How cause any significant battery drain if the data is in the dedicated
RAM? Whatever, I guess that the file is written like VNC transfers data
to a remote desktop and only records changes.

Surely, the only way that you'll find out this is if some "third party"
rewrites it for you...
--
teleportation kills
  #26  
Old June 7th 17, 05:16 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
PAS[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 595
Default iOS 11 and macOS High Sierra

On 6/7/2017 11:36 AM, nospam wrote:
In article , PAS wrote:

I thought the quote from the head of marketing,
referring to the HomePod speakers, put it in a
nutshell:

"You don't have to know what any of that is; just
know that it sounds incredible"

The HomePod has better specs than the Echo or Google Home in it's build
quality. The HomePod is larger than the other two which allows for a
larger subwoofer. it also has seven tweeters. No one has been able to
report on it's sound quality yet but I expect it to be better than
either the Echo or Google Home.

some journalists have heard it, although not in ideal conditions and
certainly not in their own home.


I've been searching for that since I made the last post. Reports are
that the sound is very good and that's no surprise.


If it's worth almost three times the
price of the Google Home or double the price of the Echo is a question
for the user to answer.

yep. it also does a lot more.


It does a lot more than an Echo? Nope, not yet.


Microsoft's Cortana enabled device is made by
Harman Kardon and I expect it to have superior sound qaulity to the Echo
and Goold Home just as the HomePod will. It most likely will have a
price closer to the HomePod.

probably.

Amazon allows the smart assistant to be used by third party
manufacturers and there are thousands of "skills" it has. It has a leg
up on all the other assistants because of that. We all know how much of
a "closed" system the HomePod will be so it remains to be seen how fast
the functionality of the HomePod can even come close to an Echo or
Google Home.

it's not closed. developers can add siri functionality if they want,
which will be usable from a homepod, iphone, ipad and mac.


Note the quotation marks I put around the word "closed". It's a
"closed" system compared to the Echo and Google Home. Let's not mix
words, we all know what I mean by this.
  #27  
Old June 7th 17, 06:01 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Savageduck[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 16,487
Default iOS 11 and macOS High Sierra

On 2017-06-07 16:24:48 +0000, Tony Cooper said:

On Wed, 07 Jun 2017 11:36:22 -0400, nospam
wrote:

In article , Tony Cooper
wrote:

If Live Photos is a mode that can be turned on or off, it would seem
that this adds battery drain when it is on.

Yes or no?

no.

there is no reason why it would.

I'm not "claiming" it is draining the battery, but am asking why the
battery is not increasing in use because the camera is recording that
extra 1.5 seconds at all times when that mode is on.

because it's not recording anything unless you actually take a photo.

the live preview, which occurs any time the camera app is open, is
buffered in memory for autofocus, autoexposure, face detection, special
effects and much more, whether or not live photos is on or off.

if live photos is off, just the photo is saved to flash.

if live photos is on, then the photo plus the last 1.5 seconds of the
memory buffer is saved, plus the following 1.5 seconds unless the
camera moved enough to where the video is no longer relevant. {*]

even if you don't take any photos at all, the phone is still using
power to run the camera app, get data from the sensor, display it on
the screen, etc.

the amount of power to write a file to flash, even if the file is
slightly bigger when it contains video, is negligible compared to
everything else that's going on.

If I read that correctly, the answer to my question is "Yes", not
"No", but the contention is that the battery drain is negligible and -
assumedly - will not affect the phone's performance.


then you read it incorrectly.

the only difference in battery drain is in writing a slightly larger
file, taking a tiny fraction of a second longer, a difference so small
that the amount of additional power probably can't be measured, let
alone noticed by the user.


I find it absolutely fascinating the lengths you will go in arguing
that you are right when it's patently obvious that you are wrong. And,
when your own words prove you wrong.

You insist that I am "incorrect" when I allow that the battery drain
is "negligible" by insisting that, instead, "the difference is so
small (that it) can't be measured". What in the hell do you think
"negligible" means? Here's a clue from the dictionary: "Negligible:
so small or unimportant as to be not worth considering,
insignificant".

You insist that I am incorrect when I allow that it will not affect
the phone's performance by countering that it won't be noticed by the
user. In other words, it wouldn't affect the phone's performance.

The question was asked if leaving the feature on will cause battery
drain, and requested a "yes" or "no" answer. You said "no", and then
went on to agree that it does. A correct answer from you would have
been "yes, but the drain is so negligible that it is a non-issue."

You create arguments where there should be no argument by misstating
something and then digging in by claiming there was no misstatement.

Fascinating. Absolutely fascinating.


Hell! My iPhone in standby mode with nothing used at all will still
drain the battery.
--
Regards,

Savageduck

  #28  
Old June 7th 17, 06:25 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24,165
Default iOS 11 and macOS High Sierra

In article 201706071001105400-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom, Savageduck
wrote:


Hell! My iPhone in standby mode with nothing used at all will still
drain the battery.


the only difference between standby and in-use is that the display is
off in standby. apps continue to run in the background.

if you turn the phone completely off, the battery will self-discharge.
  #29  
Old June 7th 17, 06:25 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24,165
Default iOS 11 and macOS High Sierra

In article , Tony Cooper
wrote:

In that case, there would be no difference other than in storage space.

I'm not claiming that leaving the feature on is a problem. It just
didn't seem logical to me that leaving the feature on does not result
in *some* battery drain. If the battery drain is minimal, and doesn't
affect the performance of the phone, then it's not a problem.


it's not only minimal, but it's too small to be measured.


Actually, something that is "minimal" can always be measured. Whether
or not it's worthwhile to measure is a different point. If a
difference exists, it can be measured.


not always. the tools need to be accurate enough, and in this case they
aren't even remotely close.
  #30  
Old June 7th 17, 06:25 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24,165
Default iOS 11 and macOS High Sierra

In article , Tony Cooper
wrote:

If I read that correctly, the answer to my question is "Yes", not
"No", but the contention is that the battery drain is negligible and -
assumedly - will not affect the phone's performance.


then you read it incorrectly.

the only difference in battery drain is in writing a slightly larger
file, taking a tiny fraction of a second longer, a difference so small
that the amount of additional power probably can't be measured, let
alone noticed by the user.


I find it absolutely fascinating the lengths you will go in arguing
that you are right when it's patently obvious that you are wrong. And,
when your own words prove you wrong.


they do not. as usual, you don't understand the issues.

You insist that I am "incorrect" when I allow that the battery drain
is "negligible" by insisting that, instead, "the difference is so
small (that it) can't be measured". What in the hell do you think
"negligible" means? Here's a clue from the dictionary: "Negligible:
so small or unimportant as to be not worth considering,
insignificant".


you said the answer to your question is yes. that is wrong. the answer
is no.

would you consider the battery of your camera to drain faster if you
set it to high compression jpeg (smallest file) versus high quality
jpeg (largest file)? because that's essentially the same thing.

do you worry about a difference in your vehicle's fuel economy when you
drive solo versus when you have 5 people in it? more weight means lower
fuel economy.

You insist that I am incorrect when I allow that it will not affect
the phone's performance by countering that it won't be noticed by the
user. In other words, it wouldn't affect the phone's performance.


performance has absolutely nothing to do with battery life. that's a
separate issue entirely. you are very, very confused.

there is *zero* impact to performance. none whatsoever. zip.

The question was asked if leaving the feature on will cause battery
drain, and requested a "yes" or "no" answer. You said "no", and then
went on to agree that it does. A correct answer from you would have
been "yes, but the drain is so negligible that it is a non-issue."


nope. the answer is no because nobody outside of an engineering lab
with exotic test equipment can find a difference, and even then,
probably not.

i only mentioned the write time difference because people like you try
to find an argument out of *anything*, had i not, you'd have said 'but
you didn't mention that it takes longer to write a larger file'.

You create arguments where there should be no argument by misstating
something and then digging in by claiming there was no misstatement.


it ain't me who is creating an argument.
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
iOS 11 and macOS High Sierra Sandman Digital Photography 9 June 7th 17 04:25 PM
Nikon image download - OSX Sierra Nige Danton[_2_] Digital Photography 13 November 11th 16 12:34 AM
OsX or MacOS - which should I go with? Tony Soprano Digital Photography 3 February 10th 05 05:27 AM
OsX or MacOS - which should I go with? gutts 35mm Photo Equipment 2 February 10th 05 05:27 AM
OsX or MacOS - which should I go with? John A. Weeks III 35mm Photo Equipment 6 February 9th 05 03:01 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:35 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 PhotoBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.