Off Topic: 30 Killed in Protest as Outrage over Cartoons Spreads

"William Graham" wrote:


"Tony Polson" wrote in message
news
"William Graham" wrote:

If you have a better idea, I
would like to hear it. Besides, those poor Iranians need a few Pizza
parlors
and Hooters in downtown Teheran..........And I want my president to give
it
to them!


There was a time when there were a great many American-style
businesses operating in Teheran. Teheran was the capital of a corrupt
and decadent dictatorship, one of the worst the world has ever seen.

That is what American influence did to Iran. I see no possible
justification to do it all over again.

I do. Most of the Iranian people long for the return of those days. (Under
the Shah)


On the contrary, the Shah was deposed by the sheer will of the unarmed
Iranian people despite the Shah's vast arsenal of US-supplied weapons.
It was a hugely popular move.

The current hardline Iranian President was democratically elected in
preference to a candidate who leaned more to the West and towards a
rapprochement with the USA. That says more than anything else about
the will of the Iranian people.

There is no evidence whatsoever that the Iranians would welcome a
return to the corrupt and decadent days of the US-financed Shah,
unless you judge Iranians on the basis of Iranian refugees living in
the USA.

Well, they would say that, wouldn't they?

:-)

"William Graham" wrote:

I wanted us to take over
the world in 1945


After that statement, any further discussion is pointless.

Paul Furman wrote:

It's not that simple to fix these places. You can't just go in & shoot a
bunch of guns and make things better. That's often the problem not the
solution.


What doesn't help is that the US invades other countries and *fails*.

The US lost in Korea, Vietnam, Somalia ...

OK, the US "won" in Grenada, but a more insignificant speck on the map
of the world would be hard to find.

"William Graham" wrote in message
. ..
snipped
There is hardly any culture on earth that didn't take their property away
from some other culture that had it before them.

so very true. so they ought to get used to it.


There is no way to
historically ascertain what belongs to whom, and restore it to them. Such
a thing would be logistically impossible. For one thing, the people who
had it before are no longer there. Their children are there, and those
children are usually contaminated with the blood of their conquerors. Try
to find a full blooded American Indian.....Virtually impossible. So, the
best thing one can do is to divvy up the property as best as possible, and
negotiate some kind of settlement that is fair to all. It is easy to take
land away from people. It is very hard to return it to them fairly. The
Soviets took away the people's land. Now, it is impossible, after only 50
years or so, to return it to the rightful owners......

"William Graham" wrote in message
. ..

"Jasen" wrote in message news:43e9297a$0$3697
Start writing, start talking to people who think like you to want to stop
US
aggression if that's what you want

No. You've got me all wrong. I don't want to stop. "US aggression" as you
put it. I think we have been way too wishy-washy. I wanted us to take over
the world in 1945, and, failing that, I have wanted us to send in the
marines countless hundreds of times since then, when they could have done
some good. Had Kennedy not been so wishy-washy, (for example) we would
have liberated Cuba back in the 60's and the people there would have been
immensely better off than they have been for the last 40 years under
Castro. Kennedy should have supported the invasion with our air force, and
Castro would have been history.
But all we have done since 1945, has been pitiful mop-up operations.
(or Not, as the case may be) we have basically stood by and done nothing
while countless millions of innocent people have been enslaved and
murdered by their corrupt maniacal governments. And I hate our leaders for
this. I hear the millions of buried voices crying out from their graves
when I go to sleep every night. It's a good thing that I don't believe in
God, or I would be terrified of death, and the terrible price I would have
to pay for turning my back on these poor wretches. What kind of God would
forgive anyone for this? - Apparently, your Christian God does.....You
hope!


Who said I was Christian?? Atheist mate. Atheist through and through. I
think we both misunderstand eachother here.

"Paul Furman" wrote in message
t...
It's not that simple to fix these places. You can't just go in & shoot a
bunch of guns and make things better. That's often the problem not the
solution.


I have to agree here.




William Graham wrote:

"Jasen" wrote in message news:43e9297a$0$3697
Start writing, start talking to people who think like you to want to stop
US

aggression if that's what you want


No. You've got me all wrong. I don't want to stop. "US aggression" as you
put it. I think we have been way too wishy-washy. I wanted us to take
over the world in 1945, and, failing that, I have wanted us to send in
the marines countless hundreds of times since then, when they could have
done some good. Had Kennedy not been so wishy-washy, (for example) we
would have liberated Cuba back in the 60's and the people there would
have been immensely better off than they have been for the last 40 years
under Castro. Kennedy should have supported the invasion with our air
force, and Castro would have been history.
But all we have done since 1945, has been pitiful mop-up operations.
(or Not, as the case may be) we have basically stood by and done nothing
while countless millions of innocent people have been enslaved and
murdered by their corrupt maniacal governments. And I hate our leaders
for this. I hear the millions of buried voices crying out from their
graves when I go to sleep every night. It's a good thing that I don't
believe in God, or I would be terrified of death, and the terrible price
I would have to pay for turning my back on these poor wretches. What kind
of God would forgive anyone for this? - Apparently, your Christian God
does.....You hope!

(laughing) so we're down to remarking about intelligence now hey, very
mature......and so much for the US governments intelligence too, right?
Deluded your public, right in the smacker! Unfortunately, most of us here
thought it too......our "little america" has been deluded by your
governments rhetoric.

Hey dude, those remarks were directed towards the moron Kewfi and his
totally lame logic.

Every country deludes their citizens - don't you know that.
Totalitarian systems though will kill you if you try to expose that
fact.

Every country uses rhetoric and other forms of verbal sales techniques.
What are you talking about?

I'm a democrat because I prefer as much protection of natural
resources. Republicans are more directed towards big buisness.
Republicans tell me that they are repub because big business needs help
so that there are jobs.... Big business will always survive on its own
- so one will always step in to "save" the situation and make big
profits; the wilderness on the other hand will not survive without
help. But whatever - wish their were more serious contenders that just
the 2 biggies.

Whatever to 35mm photog?

Sounds like a lot of people here damn near hate a lot of other people
here. Lots of difference of opinions. Lots of different interpretations
on worldwide events - what they mean, how they started, what the
ulterior motive behind them was, etc... We have the starting of a war
here. What would happen if we were all discussing this face to face
somewhere from any law enforcement - would we impose our wills, form
allies, kill those who oppose our beliefs. That's how it all starts.

God - might as well believe in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny. I'm
agnostic at best, atheist at worst. If there is a god he's not a
monster - the majority of horrible things that happens to us humans are
done by fellow humans.

It's inevitable - I say give the cockroaches a chance and see if they
can do better. Or better friggin find a way to make it to another solar
system with planets or satellites that can support life - it sure seems
like our future is pretty damn bleak.

So, what IS your political agenda?

My agenda is open and straight forward, I would like to see Israel cease to
exist in it's current form. I would like the sore that is causing a serious
infection between Christian & Muslim relations to be healed.

"Father Kodak" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 7 Feb 2006 23:55:14 -0000, "Joseph Kewfi"
wrote:



Jews never lived in an exclusively Jewish state that afforded them higher
rights over non-Jews. If Jews want to legitimately stay in Palestine they

the ancient state of Israel (and Judea).

should start reforming "Israel" into a secular democracy inclusive of
all.
There is no future for an apartheid Zionist state, whether it ends
through
violence or political reform, only the future will tell.

Actually, Arabs have more political rights in Israel than they do in
most Arab countries.

As for "apartheid," how do you explain the recent withdrawl from Gaza,
due to the recognition that Israel cannot afford to rule other peoples
and maintain its democratic nature.

It's interesting that the Arab leaders who call for a "secular"
Israel, they themselves rule over countries which persecute their
non-Muslim minorities.

And by the way, the Christian population of the Palestinian
territories has been declining, because of Muslim persecution of
Christian Palestinians.

The truth is out there. It just turns out to be more complex than you
would like it to be.

So, what IS your political agenda?

Father Kodak

Tony Polson wrote in
:

Paul Furman wrote:

It's not that simple to fix these places. You can't just go in & shoot a
bunch of guns and make things better. That's often the problem not the
solution.


What doesn't help is that the US invades other countries and *fails*.

The US lost in Korea

South Korea is communist now?