b/w negative curl

Wanting to scan old 35mm b/w negs of Kodak's Plus X and Super XX taken in
the early 1950s I removed the rolls from the metal film cans or the
cardboad forms they were wound on and cut them into 5 or 6 frame lengths so
they would fit into my scanner's (Minolta Scan Dual II) neg tray.
Due to the lengthwise curl from 50 years of storage I have had all the
lengths laying flat under heavy weights for over a year expecting they
would flatten out.
Such is not the case as it is a battle trying to get the still curled
lengths to stay put long enough to close down the tray's top section.
Since the Scan Dual II wants negs placed in the tray emulsion side up that
makes it harder yet.
Any suggestions will be appreciated.

Ted
Oregon

--
Message posted via http://www.photokb.com

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 03:31:18 GMT, "Ted Quackenbush via PhotoKB.com"
wrote:

Since the Scan Dual II wants negs placed in the tray emulsion side up that
makes it harder yet.
Any suggestions will be appreciated.

Ted
Oregon

Wind them around something about the same or smaller diameter
in the opposite direction. Refixing and washing in warm water (again
wound in the inside-out manner) may help.


Regards,

John S. Douglas, Photographer - http://www.puresilver.org
Please remove the "_" when replying via email

" ... under heavy weights ... " What have you used to protect the
surface of the film? I've a similar problem. I plan to rewash,
squeegee,
then blotter dry with some weight the damp film. Of course some lint
free, air permeable material will be needed.
Dan

"John" wrote:

Wind them around something about the same or smaller diameter
in the opposite direction. Refixing and washing in warm water (again
wound in the inside-out manner) may help.

Excellent advice, John. I have had good success with this very procedure.

A while back my brother and I discovered a large number of rolls of
processed and uncut 35mm B&W negatives made by our late father in the 50s
and 60s. They had been stored, several rolls together concentrically and
tightly wound, inside their original metal Kodak film cans. The goal was to
scan them for posterity and traditionally print some of them in a wet
darkroom for fun. Their tight, slinky-link curl made both goals virtually
impossible.

We carefully removed the rolls from their cans and wound dry them in reverse
onto stainless reels. Each roll was then pre-soaked, refixed, rewashed,
rinsed in isopropyl alcohol and dried dust-free while remaining on the reel.
Upon removal from the reels, the films were reasonably flat.

Before they could recurl (the ambient humidity was low) we then cut them
into strips and inserted the strips into traditional plastic negative pages.
These pages were then placed under moderate, full-coverage weight for a few
weeks, or so.

The result was strips of negatives with a radius of curvature well within
the (Nikon) scanner's engineering specs. Although I have yet to print any
in my darkroom - they are still being scanned - I anticipate no problems
using the negative carrier on my Omega D5XL.

(Note: Due to their manner of storage, the negatives are very heavily
scratched due to the binding effect when they were initially rolled up. The
damage is such that the only technology with a reasonable chance of
acceptable restoration will be digital. Traditional prints will have a
pronounced "historic" look from the scratches, but would be a hand-spotting
nightmare. The good news is that half a century in tightly sealed cans has
left them pristinely clean.)

Ken

"John" wrote:

Wind them around something about the same or smaller diameter
in the opposite direction. Refixing and washing in warm water (again
wound in the inside-out manner) may help.

Excellent advice, John. I have had good success with this very procedure.

A while back my brother and I discovered a large number of rolls of
processed and uncut 35mm B&W negatives made by our late father in the 50s
and 60s. They had been stored, several rolls together concentrically and
tightly wound, inside their original metal Kodak film cans. The goal was to
scan them for posterity and traditionally print some of them in a wet
darkroom for fun. Their tight, slinky-link curl made both goals virtually
impossible.

We carefully removed the rolls from their cans and wound dry them in reverse
onto stainless reels. Each roll was then pre-soaked, refixed, rewashed,
rinsed in isopropyl alcohol and dried dust-free while remaining on the reel.
Upon removal from the reels, the films were reasonably flat.

Before they could recurl (the ambient humidity was low) we then cut them
into strips and inserted the strips into traditional plastic negative pages.
These pages were then placed under moderate, full-coverage weight for a few
weeks, or so.

The result was strips of negatives with a radius of curvature well within
the (Nikon) scanner's engineering specs. Although I have yet to print any
in my darkroom - they are still being scanned - I anticipate no problems
using the negative carrier on my Omega D5XL.

(Note: Due to their manner of storage, the negatives are very heavily
scratched due to the binding effect when they were initially rolled up. The
damage is such that the only technology with a reasonable chance of
acceptable restoration will be digital. Traditional prints will have a
pronounced "historic" look from the scratches, but would be a hand-spotting
nightmare. The good news is that half a century in tightly sealed cans has
left them pristinely clean.)

Ken

Looks like main consensus to fix my problem will be to opposite wind any
rolls I've not yet cut into strips. The strips I have cut and are under
weight are in the plastic pages made for neg strips. I have no darkroom
experience so won't try any of the washing techniques. I have purchased
99.9 % Isopropyl alcohol to wipe dust, etc., before scan attempts.
I was also guilty of putting away many negs rolled concentrically so 2 or
more rolls could fit into one can.
Thanks to all who responded to my question.




Ted Q

--
Message posted via http://www.photokb.com

Looks like main consensus to fix my problem will be to opposite wind any
rolls I've not yet cut into strips. The strips I have cut and are under
weight are in the plastic pages made for neg strips. I have no darkroom
experience so won't try any of the washing techniques. I have purchased
99.9 % Isopropyl alcohol to wipe dust, etc., before scan attempts.
I was also guilty of putting away many negs rolled concentrically so 2 or
more rolls could fit into one can.
Thanks to all who responded to my question.




Ted Q

--
Message posted via http://www.photokb.com

It's probably late to jump into this but some films have more curl than
others, I usually try to cut and file my negatives within 24hours of drying
into file pages. The weight of the stack of pages in my negative file
albums will usually flatten any slight curl. I hesitate to "backroll" any
but the most curled films, there is some danger that you will scratch the
negatives, if I have to backroll I usually cut the film into strips first,
sleeve each strip in poly sleeving and rack them emulsion side out into 35mm
bulk film cans.

--
darkroommike

----------
"Ted Quackenbush via PhotoKB.com" wrote in message
. ..
Looks like main consensus to fix my problem will be to opposite wind any
rolls I've not yet cut into strips. The strips I have cut and are under
weight are in the plastic pages made for neg strips. I have no darkroom
experience so won't try any of the washing techniques. I have purchased
99.9 % Isopropyl alcohol to wipe dust, etc., before scan attempts.
I was also guilty of putting away many negs rolled concentrically so 2 or
more rolls could fit into one can.
Thanks to all who responded to my question.




Ted Q

--
Message posted via http://www.photokb.com

In article ,
"Ted Quackenbush via PhotoKB.com" wrote:

Wanting to scan old 35mm b/w negs of Kodak's Plus X and Super XX taken in
the early 1950s I removed the rolls from the metal film cans or the
cardboad forms they were wound on and cut them into 5 or 6 frame lengths so
they would fit into my scanner's (Minolta Scan Dual II) neg tray.
Due to the lengthwise curl from 50 years of storage I have had all the
lengths laying flat under heavy weights for over a year expecting they
would flatten out.
Such is not the case as it is a battle trying to get the still curled
lengths to stay put long enough to close down the tray's top section.
Since the Scan Dual II wants negs placed in the tray emulsion side up that
makes it harder yet.
Any suggestions will be appreciated.

If you have film spirals I'd suggest winding them onto these emulsion
side out or tape the end of a film to a film canister and roll the film
around this. For the strips you've already cut into strips, cut short
strips of paper approx 40mm wide and apply these over the top of each
strip on the canister of add them one at a time to the spiral.

As for the neg tray on the scanner. cut a length of heavy card the same
size as a film strip, wedge one end down, unroll, edge out the card with
the hinged flap almost closed. BTW please remember it is very easy to
flip an image in Photoshop.

In article ,
"Ted Quackenbush via PhotoKB.com" wrote:

Wanting to scan old 35mm b/w negs of Kodak's Plus X and Super XX taken in
the early 1950s I removed the rolls from the metal film cans or the
cardboad forms they were wound on and cut them into 5 or 6 frame lengths so
they would fit into my scanner's (Minolta Scan Dual II) neg tray.
Due to the lengthwise curl from 50 years of storage I have had all the
lengths laying flat under heavy weights for over a year expecting they
would flatten out.
Such is not the case as it is a battle trying to get the still curled
lengths to stay put long enough to close down the tray's top section.
Since the Scan Dual II wants negs placed in the tray emulsion side up that
makes it harder yet.
Any suggestions will be appreciated.

If you have film spirals I'd suggest winding them onto these emulsion
side out or tape the end of a film to a film canister and roll the film
around this. For the strips you've already cut into strips, cut short
strips of paper approx 40mm wide and apply these over the top of each
strip on the canister of add them one at a time to the spiral.

As for the neg tray on the scanner. cut a length of heavy card the same
size as a film strip, wedge one end down, unroll, edge out the card with
the hinged flap almost closed. BTW please remember it is very easy to
flip an image in Photoshop.