In article .com,
Savageduck wrote:

Sandman:
No, you a

Savageduck Nikon mirrorless FF's launch. Sony FF sales about
to drop. A lot.
news.com

"I think I will skip either one of these. Nikon missed the
MILC target with these two cameras, but it is a start, so
perhaps in 4-5 years they will have a good MILC which can
replace the D850, 0r even the D500, but not yet."

That's what you said, to which I asked "in what way did they miss
the mark?" above. You're the one that comparing it to the D850 and
D500.

Then it seems silly that they are priced for folks who either own
the high end Nikon FF DSLRs, or those who are shopping for a high
end Nikon FF camera. What does Nikon want to sell, DSLRs, or MILCs?

Both, preferably. They want to *stop* losing customers to Sony. Currently
they are bleeding high end DSLR customers to high end Sony mirrorless. By
offering a high end mirrorless, they hope to stop this.

Savageduck:
Unfortunately they are positioning themselves to loose a large
share of the consumer APS-C DSLR market they own, to the other
mirrorless options.

Sandman:
Of course, since they don't have a APS-C offering yet. See above.
They are late to this party, but this is the only way to do it.
The prosumer/pro market is where the money is. The consumer market
is where everyone fights with super thin margins.

Don’t you love it when a plan comes together. ;-)

Sony does

We see this way too often in tech. Someone creates a new product niche, a
niche that isn't really innovative in itself, but it's a niche that the
major players haven't worked towards because their current business line
works "just fine". When they see large parts of the customer base move to
this new niche - they have to act, but they can't act too quick, they have
to get it right. Or they're stubborn (Microsoft when the iPhone was
released).

So being five years late is pretty much par for the course. Sony didn't rule
overnight, it took a year or two before Nikon could see the effect of the
A7, and then another year of stubbornness perhaps, and then another two
years of development of the Z line. You can't turn around something as big
as Nikon overnight.

Savageduck:
...and now Nikon is still a bunch of years behind Sony, and the
others.

Sandman:
There are no others. It's only Sony.

We are waiting on Canon.

Nikon isn't

Savageduck:
Agreed. However, as promising as the Z-cameras are from the
release hype, they have a long way to go to catch up to Sony,
and they might well have damaged their APS-C market share.

Sandman:
No, the Z6 and Z7 haven't or can't damage their APS-C market
share. People that have or were considering Nikon's APS-C cameras
have either bought a APS-S Nikon or a APS-C camera from someone
else. Nikon will - depending on how the Z series works out -
release mirrorless APS-C in the future. But the release of the Z6
and Z7 haven't changed anything for these customers today.

One would hope.

You said it yourself - you're a APS-C user yourself, and a good example of
this. You currently have a Nikon and a Fuji APS-C, your next camera could be
a Nikon D500 or another Fuji, the existence of the Z6 hasn't changed
anything for you. It's not like you'd choose the Fuji *because* Nikon
released the Z6. If anything, you are allowed to be a bit miffed about the
fact that Nikon doesn't yet have an APS-C mirrorless lineup timeline, but
that doesn't change what products that are available to you today.

Sandman:
While the A6XXX Sony series seem to be doing well, I don't think
it's doing as well as the Nikon/Canon APS-C cameras. The place
where Sony is doing really well is in FF mirrorless, i.e the A7/9
series. Or rather the A7 series, I don't know if the A9 have been
an enormous success.

I guess the old Chinese curse is in effect; “May you live in
interesting times.”

So now we wait on Canon to see what they deliver to the FF MILC
fight.

Indeed. Canon is in the same boat as Nikon here. Or rather, they're still
outside the boat, but when they do get into the boat, they have to start
from scratch. Well, unless they use the same mount to have 100% backwards
compatibility, then they have a real edge.

...and we wait another 2-5 years to see if Nikon does anything with
APS-C for MILC.

Something like that. Give it at least two years before Nikon can determine
if the Z line has been a success.

--
Sandman