In article iRimd.102558$R05.20371@attbi_s53,
"William Graham" wrote:

"Rob Mitchell" wrote in message
...

Huge, meaningless rant.........

Would that be the "rant" I actually posted, or yet another "rant" that
you've merely *imagined* that I posted?

Like you have *imagined* that I have ever once suggested that all guns
should simply be eliminated completely from our society.

I've just read, & replied to your article in which you made that very
false claim about me.

As I did there, I will again here challenge you to quote me making any
statement whatsoever to the effect that I believe all guns should be
banned, or immediately retract your bold-faced lie about me.

In that same article I've already quoted you saying what you denied that
you said. You denied having said that even criminals should have the
right to bear arms, but I quoted your November 9 article verbatim in
which you said precisely that.

But you'll be utterly unable to quote what I'm now denying having ever
said, because I never said it in any article I've ever posted. I have
never once expressed any belief that all guns should be eliminated.

Since I don't search people who come into my home, and I believe that
everyone should carry a gun whenever possible, I do believe that you, and
everyone else who comes into my home, has, (or should have) the right to
carry a gun. I believe this right is guaranteed by the second amendment.
Now, having said that, I also believe that you have the right to prohibit
anyone from coming into your home that you choose, for whatever reason you
choose. You can prohibit me from coming into your home just because you
don't like my looks. If you couple that with the fact that you couldn't tell
what I was carrying in my pocket anyway, we are obviously in somewhat of a
quandary here. Your basic right of home ownership takes precedence, I
believe, so you can keep anyone out of your home that you want, for whatever
reason you want.

You're still not addressing exactly what I said. I was quite obviously
talking about when I ***DO*** know you're carrying a gun, regardless of
how I happen to learn it. I say that I need no other reason than that
to order you off my property, & you plainly agree, since above you say,
"I also believe that you have the right to prohibit anyone from coming
into your home that you choose, for whatever reason you choose."

That's exactly right. For ANY reason I choose. That would INCLUDE me
learning that you're carrying a gun onto my property. So indeed you are
plainly agreeing with me that this indeed is a "time" in which you can't
carry a gun, & that thus your own "at all times" argument is specious.
You CANNOT carry a gun at any "time" in which I learn that you're trying
to do so on MY property if I choose to prohibit you from doing so.

Thank you.

Finally.

Does that answer your question?

Yeppers. ;-)

If not, then I don't know
what you want, and I can't help you.

Oh, you've "helped" me quite a bit.

Well, not really.

I knew all along that you agree with me more than you think you do. Not
about everything, of course. But about this particular thing you merely
*thought* your disagreement with me was more substantial than it
actually was.

But I'm sorry, that seems par for the course for you, William. You seem
quite often to think that I'm making a completely different argument
from what I'm actually making. Remember when I was simply challenging
you on your claims that most liberals advocate complete banning of guns,
& also primarily advocate it only because of accidents? Oh no, you
didn't agree with me that that isn't common to the majority, but you
also didn't even *understand* at first what I was challenging you about,
since you kept going off into all sorts of tangents which had nothing at
all to do with my challenge. And now, today, you come up with the
whopper, that I myself actually advocate the utter absurdity of banning
guns completely, something I've never advocated.

And in light of that, I'm now going to AGAIN challenge your claim that
most liberals advocate complete banning of firearms from the populace.
You made the claim that most of the liberals you have met advocate this.
Yet we all see you here making this same claim about me, even though
I've never said such a thing, & don't even come close in actual truth to
believing such a thing. Since you have so obviously attributed falsely
to me an attitude which I simply do not possess, & never have, I now
suspect that you may have also falsely attributed this same attitude to
many of these liberals you have met. I never said such a thing, & yet
you attribute this attitude to me. It now seems likely that you've also
attributed this attitude to these liberals when some of them also have
never said such a thing.

In short, since I now have seen you tell this same lie about me, without
a shred of evidence to support it, I no longer believe your claim that
most of the liberals you've met possess this same attitude. You are
obviously not at all objective about this matter. If you're capable of
making this same mistake about me, you're obviously capable of making it
about others too. All I've ever done is suggest certain very limited
*restrictions* to guns, such as certain very limited *situations* where
people shouldn't be allowed to carry them, or certain very limited
*places* where they shouldn't, such as aboard airlines. That's a far
cry from advocating a complete ban on guns. Yet that alone was enough
for you to jump to the unwarranted conclusion that I actually want a
complete ban from the whole populace. It's quite likely that you've
jumped to the same conclusion about others too. I now feel virtually
certain that at least *some* of these liberals you met merely suggested
some restrictions, & you interpreted that as suggesting a complete ban.

Just as I now know beyond all possible doubt that you did with me.

QUOTE me saying that I believe in eliminating guns, damn you, or retract.
--
"God defines the law now? Does black rod bang on the almighty one's
front-porch anually only to get a harp slammed in his face for his
trouble?" - Subtext Whore on 10-28-04.